How many eicr in a day

[magnoliafan89]

Hi guys whats your take of how many EICRs can be done properly in a day average of 5 to 8 circuits ranging from 1 bed flats to 3 bed houses?? This would also include travel and also doing any repairs whilst there?

 

[richy3333]

@Brian Taylor please could you describe what your inspection of the installation involves for a £40 EICR? Lots of talk of testing from everyone but nothing about inspection?

 

[Brian Taylor]

@Brian Taylor please could you describe what your inspection of the installation involves for a £40 EICR? Lots of talk of testing from everyone but nothing about inspection?

yes certainly..the inspection part of a test is exactly what it says your are looking to determine any departures from a set standard, this begins at the onset of the test with a check of the installation to determine that it's safe to test e.g. Any bare cabling is made safe. We need to know that everything is secure and not about to fall off the wall and that enclosures are intact, not damaged and
of the correct IP rating also that fittings and accessories are correct for the area/zone installed not to mention. Correct rating/ short circuit rating of protective devices,switches and isolators. In short we are checking the installation against the relevant parts of the tick box sheets in the cert. I think what comes with experience is the ability to determine what is important and what is not, something that the younger sparks(and a fair few older ones) find great difficulty in doing. By way of an example i would not automatically condem an installation simply because it has red and black wiring..what difference does the colour of the cables make to electricity?...as long as it passes an insulation test the tester has done his job and might merit only a passing comment. As an aside I'm currently trying to find the death rates due to electrocution for the last few years....I'm guessing that deaths due to other causes e.g. Road traffic accidents it will be very much higher as yet I've found a figure for 1972 which suggests that 17 people died as a result of fixed wiring installations. I make the fixed wiring point simply because although 1875 deaths were recorded 85% of these were due to faulty appliances and other causes....just found a figure for deaths due to road accident these being 3689

 

[DPG]

I'm sure nobody would condemn an installation for having red/black colours!!!

 

[davesparks]

I'm sure nobody would condemn an installation for having red/black colours!!!

One of our regular customers had their EICR done by a testing company, amongst other things they gave red and black colours a C3 with a recommendation to oversleeve with brown and blue at all terminations!

They also have C3's for no isolators being installed for equipment which is so close to the DB that there isn't physically space to get an isolator in between them.

 

[UNG]

No I'm from the South East and I think we have the opposite situation here in that we have too many tradesmen chasing too little work

Don't how you come to the conclusion you do, here is 5 pages of jobs not to far from you from a very quick search

Electrician Jobs in Rainham - November 2024 | Essex Jobs

Search for 1000s of Electrician Jobs in Rainham. Register your CV and apply to the latest job vacancies. Find your next job with Essex Jobs

www.essexjobs.co.uk

A large testing organisation I once worked for required 50 circuits a day

The use of the limitations section helps the tester to limit the amount of work required e.g. Many will place a limit of 10% testing ie 1in every 10 circuits are tested..to do otherwise subjects the customers to the potential of massive costs of (in The case of some of the rates quoted in this site) many thousands of pounds, and of course a problem for the sparky in trying to get paid for the work . We all have to be sensible and accept that anywhere near a 100% test is not achievable at a reasonable commercial cost

So 50 circuits a day has now come down to 5 tested circuits and 45 noted or is it 500 circuits a day with 50 tested circuits and 450 noted
100% tests are viable yes they are not as cheap as your EICR's but wouldn't cost the thousands you claim unless it was a very large installation but then again it depends what peace of mind the customer wants

I'm sorry if I've dissolutioned you but that's the way the cookie crumbles and testing a large installation would be like painting the Fourth Bridge..it would never end .

Some very large installations are like that and the customer / dutyholder is prepared to pay that price to avoid the possibility of talking to people wearing wigs who may decide that a stay in one of Her Majesties hotels is necessary because someone died or was seriously injured


EICR's are not some sort of game when you sign it you are making a statement that could and would be used as evidence in a court either for or against you, I have always found it odd that the client does not have to sign it in the limitations section to agree to any limitations as currently the tester does not have any proof that the customer was made aware of them and agreed them after the EICR is done
I also think that the certificates should be changed so green is a satisfactory EICR and red is an unsatisfactory EICR it would make it a lot clearer for everyone involved in the management of premises where a valid EICR is a requirement

 

[KennyKen]

Brian.... I’m a little perturbed, I used to live in Rainham Essex prior to my departure from the UK. There was so much work. Even when the financial crash of 2008 happened. My day rate was still £150 a day and I was a subbie like yourself.
It doesn’t look good when your pricing other sparks out of the market with ridiculously low rates. Value yourself and Value the Trade.
Over here if you pull that B/S you’ll be blacklisted from the wholesalers. Sparks talk we know what the ball park figures should be. That way it’s a fair crack on your customer relations skills rather than a race to the bottom.

Funnily enough there is a massive Tesco in rainham village. Hit them up.

 

[Brian Taylor]

I'm sure nobody would condemn an installation for having red/black colours!!!

well no sensible operator would but I've had a few inquiries in The past over such an issue on the basis that as it is contary to the regs it requires a rewire.
[automerge]1595782284[/automerge]

Brian.... I’m a little perturbed, I used to live in Rainham Essex prior to my departure from the UK. There was so much work. Even when the financial crash of 2008 happened. My day rate was still £150 a day and I was a subbie like yourself.
It doesn’t look good when your pricing other sparks out of the market with ridiculously low rates. Value yourself and Value the Trade.
Over here if you pull that B/S you’ll be blacklisted from the wholesalers. Sparks talk we know what the ball park figures should be. That way it’s a fair crack on your customer relations skills rather than a race to the bottom.

Funnily enough there is a massive Tesco in rainham village. Hit them up.

an interesting message but I can assure you the wholesalers over here will sell to anyone trade or public alike..also I don't see it as my job to hike my prices simply to allow others to continue to charge inflated prices..my job is to carry out the work at the cheapest possible price i can to compete with others...if they can't compete them they have to organise their business in such a way as to try and undercut me ...that's the way the capitalist system works .
[automerge]1595782466[/automerge]

well no sensible operator would but I've had a few inquiries in The past over such an issue on the basis that as it is contary to the regs it requires a rewire.
[automerge]1595782284[/automerge]

an interesting message but I can assure you the wholesalers over here will sell to anyone trade or public alike..also I don't see it as my job to hike my prices simply to allow others to continue to charge inflated prices..my job is to carry out the work at the cheapest possible price i can to compete with others...if they can't compete them they have to organise their business in such a way as to try and undercut me ...that's the way the capitalist system works .

in addition I'm not sure what the job market is like in Rainha m Essex as I've never been there
[automerge]1595783350[/automerge]

Don't how you come to the conclusion you do, here is 5 pages of jobs not to far from you from a very quick search

Electrician Jobs in Rainham - November 2024 | Essex Jobs

Search for 1000s of Electrician Jobs in Rainham. Register your CV and apply to the latest job vacancies. Find your next job with Essex Jobs

www.essexjobs.co.uk

So 50 circuits a day has now come down to 5 tested circuits and 45 noted or is it 500 circuits a day with 50 tested circuits and 450 noted
100% tests are viable yes they are not as cheap as your EICR's but wouldn't cost the thousands you claim unless it was a very large installation but then again it depends what peace of mind the customer wants



Some very large installations are like that and the customer / dutyholder is prepared to pay that price to avoid the possibility of talking to people wearing wigs who may decide that a stay in one of Her Majesties hotels is necessary because someone died or was seriously injured


EICR's are not some sort of game when you sign it you are making a statement that could and would be used as evidence in a court either for or against you, I have always found it odd that the client does not have to sign it in the limitations section to agree to any limitations as currently the tester does not have any proof that the customer was made aware of them and agreed them after the EICR is done
I also think that the certificates should be changed so green is a satisfactory EICR and red is an unsatisfactory EICR it would make it a lot clearer for everyone involved in the management of premises where a valid EICR is a requirement

I think you need to read the whole of this message....the 50 circuits a day relates to particularly odious company I worked for some time ago and although that's what they wanted it was clearly not possible to do so in order to keep the peace is us testers would simply log the circuits do a few tests write down a few observations and pack up for the day
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well no sensible operator would but I've had a few inquiries in The past over such an issue on the basis that as it is contary to the regs it requires a rewire.
[automerge]1595782284[/automerge]

an interesting message but I can assure you the wholesalers over here will sell to anyone trade or public alike..also I don't see it as my job to hike my prices simply to allow others to continue to charge inflated prices..my job is to carry out the work at the cheapest possible price i can to compete with others...if they can't compete them they have to organise their business in such a way as to try and undercut me ...that's the way the capitalist system works .
[automerge]1595782466[/automerge]

in addition I'm not sure what the job market is like in Rainha m Essex as I've never been there
[automerge]1595783350[/automerge]

I think you need to read the whole of this message....the 50 circuits a day relates to particularly odious company I worked for some time ago and although that's what they wanted it was clearly not possible to do so in order to keep the peace is us testers would simply log the circuits do a few tests write down a few observations and pack up for the day

On the question of limitations most companies will list the limitations and terms of test in their general terms and conditions in that way the customer(should they bother to read) said terms and conditions would know what they are paying for, so complaining that they are not getting what they expected after the event doesn't cut much ice

 

[richy3333]

an interesting message but I can assure you the wholesalers over here will sell to anyone trade or public alike..also I don't see it as my job to hike my prices simply to allow others to continue to charge inflated prices..my job is to carry out the work at the cheapest possible price i can to compete with others...if they can't compete them they have to organise their business in such a way as to try and undercut me ...that's the way the capitalist system works .

Have a look at the time-cost-quality triangle. I'd think that your job is to make money as an electriian isn't it? You're a business first and a sparky second. Do you not have a business model or USP? Just because somebody charges more than another doesn't make them per se expensive or 'ripping the customer off'. I see that comment a lot on the forum. By way of example if we were to both price to rewire a house and you estimated £5K and I £8K thats my price. Neither of us have gun to the customers head and its a free market so the customer can choose which company they go with.

I dont want to depress you but my 2nd year apprentice earns more than the figures you quote and I charge out per hour more than you per day/per EICR. I really dont think that a race to the bottom by charging so little is how a capitalistic society works? I really feel your pain and wish something could be done to help you increase revenue.

BTW @telectrix is semi retired and must be at least 300 years old and I bet he doesn't struggle to charge more than your quoted rates

 

[telectrix]

my tuppence woth. brian is misguided if he thinks that % testing means only testin some circuits and not others.
% testing means that you test all circuits, but only a percentage of the points on those circuits. an EICR that misses out circuits is like a MOT without checking brakes. pointless, worthless and not worth the paper.

 

[Dustydazzler]

Would love to see someone do a full Eicr on this gaff...in under a day

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98pQlrHsB3E

 

[richy3333]

And for the price of £40

 

[Brian Taylor]

Have a look at the time-cost-quality triangle. I'd think that your job is to make money as an electriian isn't it? You're a business first and a sparky second. Do you not have a business model or USP? Just because somebody charges more than another doesn't make them per se expensive or 'ripping the customer off'. I see that comment a lot on the forum. By way of example if we were to both price to rewire a house and you estimated £5K and I £8K thats my price. Neither of us have gun to the customers head and its a free market so the customer can choose which company they go with.

I dont want to depress you but my 2nd year apprentice earns more than the figures you quote and I charge out per hour more than you per day/per EICR. I really dont think that a race to the bottom by charging so little is how a capitalistic society works? I really feel your pain and wish something could be done to help you increase revenue.

BTW @telectrix is semi retired and must be at least 300 years old and I bet he doesn't struggle to charge more than your quoted rates

Not too sure I know what the time cost quality triangle is let alone a UPS and my business plan is get the work do what I need to do and get paid...isn't that anyone's plan in life, we all have to do whatever it takes to achieve this
[automerge]1595792152[/automerge]

Have a look at the time-cost-quality triangle. I'd think that your job is to make money as an electriian isn't it? You're a business first and a sparky second. Do you not have a business model or USP? Just because somebody charges more than another doesn't make them per se expensive or 'ripping the customer off'. I see that comment a lot on the forum. By way of example if we were to both price to rewire a house and you estimated £5K and I £8K thats my price. Neither of us have gun to the customers head and its a free market so the customer can choose which company they go with.

I dont want to depress you but my 2nd year apprentice earns more than the figures you quote and I charge out per hour more than you per day/per EICR. I really dont think that a race to the bottom by charging so little is how a capitalistic society works? I really feel your pain and wish something could be done to help you increase revenue.

BTW @telectrix is semi retired and must be at least 300 years old and I bet he doesn't struggle to charge more than your quoted rates

I thank you for your concern and advice but my experience is that it is always the lowest price that gets the job, given your example of the house rewire i know I would go for the cheapest every time,....were those actual prices for a house rewire in your area of do you have very large houses in your area ?
[automerge]1595792656[/automerge]

my tuppence woth. brian is misguided if he thinks that % testing means only testin some circuits and not others.
% testing means that you test all circuits, but only a percentage of the points on those circuits. an EICR that misses out circuits is like a MOT without checking brakes. pointless, worthless and not worth the paper.

Whether a certificate is worthless or not is highly subjective, as long as the customer is getting what they require i don't see a problem with the extent of the test carried out as long as it's what they want, to be honest if the customer wanted a blank certificate I'd be only too happy to oblige with a blank signed copy and charge according.

 

[David Prosser]

"to be honest if the customer wanted a blank certificate I'd be only too happy to oblige with a blank signed copy and charge according".

So fraudulent scum for £40 a pop !

 

[DPG]

You are a cowboy who shouldn't be doing work for the public.

 

[7029 dave]

Am sitting down with popcorn at the ready an all ears.