I'm officially 'At Risk' of redundancy.

[jibspark]

I received a letter today from my employer to tell me I'm officially at risk of redundancy and I'm going for a meeting next week to discuss my options.....

Things arnt looking good!

 

[Moog]

I received a letter today from my employer to tell me I'm officially at risk of redundancy and I'm going for a meeting next week to discuss my options.....

Things arnt looking good!

Real redundancy is where you have someone doing a job that the company will not need to do anymore. If the employer makes you redundant then employs some else to do your old job, you can ask for your old job back and dicker about pay lost in the interim. Depending upon how long you have been with the company these meetings are where you can ask for retraining grants, so if you want some free training to be able to get another job get some quotes and take them to the meeting with you if you dont want retraining then ask what criteria that are using to choose who is leaving and who is staying (get this in writing). If they make you redundant and they havent followed their own criteria you can improve your payout via court/ tribunal and or ask for you job back. Get a copy of the company employee manual if they dont follow their own rules then again the payout goes up and you can keep working for them until they sort it out. Usually once you have left they won't take you back but the payout will reflect this, normal payout is around 2 years wages if they have been naughty and it goes to court/ tribunal and you have been with the company 5years+. Also if this news makes you feel unwell you may have to go off sick with stress, they can't procede with the redundancy until you are well enough to deal with it, if they do they will really have to payout Bear in mind that if you do get a big payout you might never be employed in this field again, but then again you can always work for yourself.

 

[jibspark]

wow cheers mate, ive been with the company 4 years. i will get some quotes on doing my 17th and my 2391 and present this to them.

they have loads of work but they have subcontracted it out and there for have nothing left for their own men, it doesnt seem right to me.

 

[Moog]

B**tards give em some stick, does your house insurance give you free legal advice? If it does then you can get definative advices from them for free and directline for example will take them to court for you. It doesnt sound right to me either it sounds like you need some professional legal advice, ask your company to pay for a solictor at the meeting if you can't get one for free

 

[rumrunner]

wow cheers mate, ive been with the company 4 years. i will get some quotes on doing my 17th and my 2391 and present this to them.

they have loads of work but they have subcontracted it out and there for have nothing left for their own men, it doesnt seem right to me.

Hi
Sorry to hear your prediciment jib ,and moog seems to have good knowledge about what you can do .
the "trick" they are using is that they have allready started the sub contractors ,if they got rid of you say while you were in the middle of a job ,and then a subbie carried on with it ,that would be wrong ,if there on different jobs ,im not sure if it applies.
Also it depends in what capacity you are employed ,ie ,if you run jobs or just work on other peoples.
At the end of the day ,if there doing stuff like this ,i would be inclined to try and get another job lined up ,its a lot easier if you have been made redundant rather than pumped,
all the best anyway

 

[wattsup]

It is an old trick and 90% successful, some agency have contacted them...what does it cost you to employ a spark? err about £30 per hour all told...ok they say, we will send when needed @ £25 per hour, you have no worries, we will sort ni tax blah blah, no holiday payments to pay etc etc. You pay us once per month etc etc...

I'm not having a go at subbies, but that is the way all industry is going...'the new labour way' it sucks. But you cannot blame employers, with the crazy employment laws and very difficult to comprehend legislation. Who can blame them?

There are still some 'old fashioned' firms still going, but even the big ones are 50/50 on the books/subbies.

It is a con, I've done both but would always prefer on the books.

Just before I decided enough is enough, working subbie for some outfit doing tesco stuff...I turns up, have you got a 110v drill 'yes' have you got a 18v/24v drill 'yes' have you got a step ladder...err **** off, the next question will be have I got a cherry picker..get ****ed find someone else..and I would pay money to see the expression on the companies forman's face again.

The last job I worked on was a cancer hospital, x-ray dept. Concrete walls 3 feet thick in places, 6 inch lead lined doors, I have to get a micc cable within, to about 12 units..without making a noise..of course impossible. So they ask me to work out of hours (they don't give a **** about patients, as long as visitors can't hear or vip visitors) so anyhow ok I don't mind, 5am till 12 noon @ time and a half..no probs 5 days, no noise after 9am

I liked the shift it was ok, a doddle in fact more money more time off, no one wanted it on our company but 2 of us agreed to do it. I had been working their for a few months previous, so knew the building and stuff.

It took approx 2 months first fix. Guess what, when first fixed I was made redundant along with 6 or so others on the firm.

But it seems the subbies fetched in to do second fix did not understand my cable identification method - and the company invited me back for 2-weeks on double pay...get ****ed, you have already shown your hand, i'm busy with my own stuff now, and have not looked back since.

Loyalty goes a long way in my book

 

[LukeScotty]

If the employer makes you redundant then employs some else to do your old job, you can ask for your old job back

correct me if i'm wrong but the employer cant fill your space for a couple of years full stop, and if they do employ someone to fill your space then their breaking the law.

btw have you got a contract ?

 

[wattsup]

no they can't fill your space, but there are zillions of ways round it. Temp usually forefills the criteria, if not, if you were employed as an electrician, the next post would be electrical maintenance engineer, usually you would have to agree to do other 'none electrical jobs'..so it's not the same job...like i say there are litterally loads of ways round it. Sometimes they will upgrade the job title, electrical engineer for instance...

 

[Moog]

correct me if i'm wrong but the employer cant fill your space for a couple of years full stop, and if they do employ someone to fill your space then their breaking the law.

btw have you got a contract ?

Its a little wheeze they pull, get rid of your expensive qualified staff and replace with monkeys. They rename the job and add and drop some duties and they can get away scotfree. If the job is the fundamentally the same though you can go to the tribunal and argue it as unfair dismissal, redundance is just a class of fair dismissal after all. This is why the employeer has to be so careful to be seen to being super reasonable and fair, hence the free training and solictors advice. If they fail to follow their own rules or slip up in anyway it can become unfair dismissal and then they are in the lottery of court/tribunal, the legal costs alone are usually enough to make them give a fair deal out of court

 

[wattsup]

If you are employed as an electician, then they cannot make you redundant and then advertise a job for an electrician for 2-years. They ain't daft, it is really a load of bull****, there are millions of ways round it. Like in the old days, as soon as you qualified you would be booted out (cos they had to pay you more money) so they would then seek new 'apprentices'. One spark, 20 apprentices

It is going the same way, except now rather than apprentices...use the agency, save 5 quid per hour and loads of hassle

 

[EasyFox]

This might be of interest
Basic Guide to TUPE | OUT-LAW.COM
It's to do with a thing called TUPE which we had forced on us when I worked elsewhere when our employer gave up a contract.

 

[wattsup]

Moog, I don't think they replace with monkeys all the time, some subbies are ok and are just trying to make a living. It is not easy getting a job on the books comparitively with subbie work.
Many subbies are well versed in all sorts of stuff, the ones that are cowboys are usually sent home quickly.

 

[Moog]

Moog, I don't think they replace with monkeys all the time, some subbies are ok and are just trying to make a living. It is not easy getting a job on the books comparitively with subbie work.
Many subbies are well versed in all sorts of stuff, the ones that are cowboys are usually sent home quickly.

This wasnt whilst an electrician, it was IT and electronics, as I said get a big payout and don't get employed in same field again. I looked at TUPE earlier today but I dont think it applies

 

[Bane]

I think we should create a new thread aimed directly at playing the system.

Found this thread VERY interesting.

Well done all who contributed! Especially you Moog

 

[Moog]

Thanks, I vote we take off and nuke the site from orbit, its the only way to be sure