Landlords own electrical remedial work

[RobJ2778]

Hope this is ok and also posted in the correct section as this is my first post. As a landlord can I do my own electrical repairs/modifications or is there a legislation that prevents this. I know there is new legislation that requires a safety check every 5 years but is there a specific legislation that dictates I must use a registered electrician for any work other than a safety certificate or is it just considered best practice?

 

[7029 dave]

All assuming England - the rules differ between the four counties in the UK.
As stated, IF the person doing the work is competent to do so (and has the appropriate test equipment), then it is legal for them to do it. If the work doesn't include notifiable work then there's no notification to do. The ONLY notifiable works in England are replacement of a CU, addition of a circuit, work within the zones of a bathroom.

However, when you say the landlord installed his own pre-pay meter, is this in addition to (and downstream of) the supplier's meter ? It would be illegal for him to interfere with the existing meter.
There are a load of regulations that come into play when a private meter is installed, so unless he's signed up with one of the outfits that manage this sort of thing, it's highly likely that he's breaking some regulation or other relating to the private metering.

I have seen a situation where a PPM has been provided on the suppliers side, and a coin meter in the flat too fitted by the LL, both meters were being fed by the tenant, IMO morally wrong.

 

[RobJ2778]

All assuming England - the rules differ between the four counties in the UK.
As stated, IF the person doing the work is competent to do so (and has the appropriate test equipment), then it is legal for them to do it. If the work doesn't include notifiable work then there's no notification to do. The ONLY notifiable works in England are replacement of a CU, addition of a circuit, work within the zones of a bathroom.

However, when you say the landlord installed his own pre-pay meter, is this in addition to (and downstream of) the supplier's meter ? It would be illegal for him to interfere with the existing meter.
There are a load of regulations that come into play when a private meter is installed, so unless he's signed up with one of the outfits that manage this sort of thing, it's highly likely that he's breaking some regulation or other relating to the private metering.

I haven't seen the installation myself but I can only assume its downstream of the energy suppliers own meter. I have researched the type of meter that he has installed and it requires him to pay a subscription for the service provided by the manufacturer as it is an electronic system by way of a sim card and utilises an Internet based service to send the money paid onto the meter to his bank account. I'm stunned that someone unregistered and not necessarily possessing the correct skills or knowledge can effectively intercept a single phase supply to fit a meter in that way, disregarding the fact that it was a replacement. Surely this contravenes safety standards for electricity supply in a rented property not to mention the effect on any buildings insurance should damage or injury occur as a direct result of his work?

 

[Mark42]

None of this matters unless the installation is in some way non-compliant or dangerous, and so far no evidence has been presented that it is.

We need a photo please.

Out of interest, why has the landlord suddenly decided to fit a prepayment meter anyway?

 

[RobJ2778]

None of this matters unless the installation is in some way non-compliant or dangerous, and so far no evidence has been presented that it is.

We need a photo please.

Out of interest, why has the landlord suddenly decided to fit a prepayment meter anyway?

I'm not able to get a photo of the installation currently but will post one when possible. The original meter was a coin operated one which he replaced with a digital one which is topped up via the Internet.

 

[telectrix]

probably got fed up of calling round every fortnight for a bag full of shillings.

 

[Simon47]

I have seen a situation where a PPM has been provided on the suppliers side, and a coin meter in the flat too fitted by the LL, both meters were being fed by the tenant, IMO morally wrong.

Ouch. Without going and doing research to find out what's changed since I was at uni and keen to minimise what I paid the college for lecky, I suspect illegal as well. Certainly back then there was actually a regulated resale price for situations like this - setting a maximum rate chargeable on a landlord's sub meter.

I have researched the type of meter that he has installed and it requires him to pay a subscription for the service provided by the manufacturer as it is an electronic system by way of a sim card and utilises an Internet based service to send the money paid onto the meter to his bank account.

I've seen adverts for such systems, a lot to be said for it compared to keeping a bag full of coins to hand.

I'm stunned that someone unregistered and not necessarily possessing the correct skills or knowledge can effectively intercept a single phase supply to fit a meter in that way, disregarding the fact that it was a replacement. Surely this contravenes safety standards for electricity supply in a rented property not to mention the effect on any buildings insurance should damage or injury occur as a direct result of his work?

There is no requirement to be registered and never has been. While you could say he doesn't necessarily have the skills, he doesn't necessarily not have them - for all we know he may be quite competent. I'm a landlord, I do electrical works as a bit of a hobby business (complete with PL/PI insurance) - so you can't assume that the landlord does not have any skills in that area.
Also, if it's a replacement then that makes things significantly different. ADDING a meter does mean altering the wiring, and to do it properly means having the knowledge/skills to select appropriate materials and use them correctly. REPLACING an existing meter will be little more than undoing the clamp screws on four terminals, lifting the old meter off, slipping the terminals of the new meter onto the same four wires, and tightening the screws - and from what I've observed of meters, it's quite likely that the terminals are in the very same places on the new meter as they were on the old one.
Of course, if the original meter was "poorly fitted", then it's entirely possible that the new meter has inherited the same issues.

When you are able to get some, post photos here and we call all weigh in with our opinions ?

 

[Mark42]

... The original meter was a coin operated one which he replaced with a digital one which is topped up via the Internet.

That sounds an entirely sensible thing to do, and is perfectly acceptable. (So long as it's not being used to apply a rip-off tariff).

As Simon47 says above, the straight replacement of an electrical fitting needs no 'registration' or 'training' to do; legislation requires only that such work be done competently.

The landlord does own the gaff: if he wants to (competently) dick around with the electrics, or paint the walls sky blue pink, it's up to him!

 

[Simon47]

The landlord does own the gaff: if he wants to (competently) dick around with the electrics, or paint the walls sky blue pink, it's up to him!

But only between tenancies. While the property is let, the landlord actually has very few rights - the right to "quiet enjoyment" has been let to the tenant for the duration of the tenancy.
Just making things clear as a lot of people don't realise that.

 

[littlespark]

I suppose it’s fine if the LL is competent and can supply certificates to show this.

The words “dick around with the electrics” doesn’t give me much confidence however


Makes you wonder what else the LL might have done.....

Ran a spur off the socket there.... does this socket here and the one behind in the other room.... “spur off a spur” you say? Never heard of it. They work, don’t they?

I’ve replaced the gas hob as well.... just did it myself. Them Gas Safe blokes charge a fortune.

oh, and I took that wall down between the kitchen and lounge. It was brick, but I don’t think it was load bearing. Maybe... maybe not.

 

[richy3333]

If the landlord is charging more on his own meter than he pays I think he has to register as an energy provider etc. Otherwise he is breaking the law.