Legalities of incorrect polarity upon purchase.

[wade88]

Hi guys,

Now, on two occasions now, a supplier of some of our machinery have supplied machines with incorrect polarity within the plug tails.... on today's instance, this obviously ran the motor in reverse, and has caused irreversible damage to the machine in question. I have now correctly wired the plug and double checked the internal terminations. The machinery they supply is built in China, its rough round the edges to say the least, and as far as i am aware, China do not follow any standardisation when it comes to wiring things, they just sling any old cable and colour in there.

But i find it utterly unacceptable that a machine supplier who fabricates and alters these machines to suit the clients end result needs, is sufficiently incompetent enough to wire the plug wrong and then deliver it "fit for key turn use" to a customer.

Today cost me time, blood and money after the machine almost fell to bits running in reverse, and i was wondering if there are any legal ramifications of sending machines out their dooor bought and paid for, that are in my opinion, potentially not safe.

Ben

 

[gazzamikes]

The biggest problem I found was with German machines especially our presses they have the brown black grey but there's was black brown grey, always cases problems

 

[BlueToBits]

Could you not squeeze a phase monitoring relay into the control box? You can pick one up for less than £50.00

 

[44ALLAN]

- - - Updated - - -

Wade.
What's happened here is something that has probably happened to every single spark who has wired up a 3 phase motor...........it's gone in reverse.
Checking the isolator/contactor/plug wiring etc will not make one jot of difference so no-one to blame there least of all you mate.

I learnt many years ago never to trust another sparks work so as a matter of course now I always open all panels and plugs etc and check/test the wiring before energising........whatever it is.
Good practice to get into that frame of mind mate and hope you don't think I'm having a pop.............not intended just trying to be helpful for future reference.

 

[ian.settle1]

When the machine was tested in China it may have gone the correct way but it comes down to the fact the motor should have been run without the load connected to check that the motor was going in the right direction before the load was applied or you should have started it and stopped it straight away just to check the direction before it got up to speed.

 

[wade88]

It's a bucket lift conveyor, its on, or off, no wind u speed, no alteration in speed, it just runs and stops. So i turned it on to run and it ran backwards, within those few seconds, its destroyed several parts on the machine. Hence the annoyance.

But at the time of the OP, i was unaware it is so common in industry to have a jumble of phases on gear so i shall endevour in the future to take nothing for granted and expect nothing to be consistent.

 

[44ALLAN]

Typical example...... I can remember once having to hire a genny to run 2 x 37Kw 690v motors.
The skid in question was being made by sub-contractors of ours and I was on-site to power it up and witness the FAT on it.
As you can imagine it was pretty serious stuff making sure everything was ok before switching on when I noticed this guy with his head inside one of the main control panels and attempting to make off an armored gland on one of the main motor cables.
It was the same guy who the day before had been painting the skid and when I challenged him he admitted he was the welder but was often asked to 'do a bit of wiring' lol

Nothing more to say really hahahaha
Apart from.............ALWAYS check yourself

 

[Knobhead]

If it's a bucket elevator it's a wonder you didn't wreck the gearbox. They nearly always have anti run back gear in them.

 

[johnboy6083]

I agree with the always check everything ethos!
i too have wrecked gear by switching it on, but in my defence, my incident was done with a technician of 50 years (yes 50) experience on hand, he was the mechanical supervisor. I didn't know to lift the pump shaft before coupling it onto the motor. When I switched it on, the bloody thing made horrible noises and then the sacrificial pin snapped, and the pump was shagged.
Lesson now learnt, I will now check for play on the shaft first.

 

[partypest]

This is more evidence of an alarming issue. I often work in the AV industry (broadcasting) and when new equipment arrives, it all looks right, moulded three pin 1363, fuse etc. But look a bit closer, why is there sheathing on the earth pin when it's all stamped with CE and BS1363 etc? And the fuse, all marked up correctly but spin it round in the carrier, and there's a wire running down the outside of it! Bell out the moulded plug and you find the L & N are the wrong way round. The BBC introduced a new policy last year that EVERYTHING is tested, new or not, before it's allowed to be connected to anything in the broadcast compound. There were a lot of people up in arms, crying nanny'ism and a safety step too far. How right they were though. I have seen a couple of events in the last 12 mths go titsup because something that should've been able to handle x couldn't even handle q before it let it's smoke out. Be careful out there chaps and chapesses, there's some right dodgy **** being imported and not just Turkish twin & earth like a couple of years ago.