No earthing on lighting circuit

[KevinH]

Hi all, I've been asked to make an old 4 story townhouse "safe" and issue cert for renting out.
Hasn't been touched for so long it has bakerlite accessories with wood backing!
Straight away I'm seeing replace all accessories, replace CU, upgrade earthing. The wiring is all in PVC cables but typical no earthing on lighting circuits.
I hear you all scream "REWIRE"!
Problem is property is highly decorated and furnished and owners would rather not go down that route.
My question is, if I fit all plastic accessories throughout, and clearly state on CU and cert NOT to fit any metallic fittings. Can I get away with that?
Just asking as whenever I've come across this problem in past, I've always rewired lighting so bit unsure what complies.
By the way, I've done quick IR, ring loop tests, Ze etc and all ok, but how do you R1+R2 lighting with no earth?

 

[Pete999]

On by

 

[DPG]

This way.

 

[Pete999]

Wrong video appologies

 

[Deleted member 72666]

.... on the wild side.

 

[Spoon]

Congrats @Topboy . Your first post is one word and you get load of replies... I'm sooo jealous..

 

[GMES]

Sorry for starting the derailing of the thread with my reply but it did trigger some classics

 

[bonjovi]

looking at replies I can see lots of points of views ,
end of the day whatever you do if not a full rewire ,would you be happy to be in court if things went wrong , for me its rewire or walk away and let somebody else have their day in court

 

[CACJL]

Hi all, I've been asked to make an old 4 story townhouse "safe" and issue cert for renting out.
Hasn't been touched for so long it has bakerlite accessories with wood backing!
Straight away I'm seeing replace all accessories, replace CU, upgrade earthing. The wiring is all in PVC cables but typical no earthing on lighting circuits.
I hear you all scream "REWIRE"!
Problem is property is highly decorated and furnished and owners would rather not go down that route.
My question is, if I fit all plastic accessories throughout, and clearly state on CU and cert NOT to fit any metallic fittings. Can I get away with that?
Just asking as whenever I've come across this problem in past, I've always rewired lighting so bit unsure what complies.
By the way, I've done quick IR, ring loop tests, Ze etc and all ok, but how do you R1+R2 lighting with no earth?

You could convert the lighting to 24 Volt ac or 30 Volt dc, so it is classified as extra low voltage, then earth is not required.

 

[Norah Nabino]

Common sense needs to prevail. To say to a customer it is either complete re-wire and thousands of pounds worth of decorating or nothing is a little silly in my book.

There is nothing wrong with fitting plastic accessories. Remember you are not changing the circuit so you do not have to bring it up to current Standards. That said if there is nothing wrong with the existing switxhes why change them at all?

When wired it was completely acceptable to install plastic accessories and not have an earth on the circuit. If an EICR was carries out today with only plastic fittings installed it would only warrent a C3 so that in itself suggests it is not dangerous.

It does not comply with the current regulations BS7671
If he does not have R1+R2 on the lighting cct , how is he going to get Zs on this cct?
What will he record on the certificate?

 

[Nebu1a]

Just the IR readings for the lighting circuits and "no protective conductor in lighting circuits"

 

[Nebu1a]

in the comments section.

 

[Nebu1a]

If they dont want any damage how about a lovely surface mounted trunking rewire.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I’ve had the situation where the customer wanted to install metal light switches, but there’s been no CPC.
I pointed her in the direction of B&Q, who were selling plastic switches with a metallic looking plastic cover.
Her particular back boxes had nylon blocks for the metal 3.5mm screws to screw into.
Had another situation where the customer thought a fly lead from the unearthed back box to the metal switch would suffice.
Did I try to force them to have a rewire?
No, I just explained that they can only use plastic switches and fittings.

 

[johnduffell]

You could convert the lighting to 24 Volt ac or 30 Volt dc, so it is classified as extra low voltage, then earth is not required.

Great idea although for clarity itit would have to be separated extra low voltage to ensure adequate isolation between the mains and the output.

 

[l4urence]

Common sense needs to prevail. To say to a customer it is either complete re-wire and thousands of pounds worth of decorating or nothing is a little silly in my book.

There is nothing wrong with fitting plastic accessories. Remember you are not changing the circuit so you do not have to bring it up to current Standards. That said if there is nothing wrong with the existing switxhes why change them at all?

When wired it was completely acceptable to install plastic accessories and not have an earth on the circuit. If an EICR was carries out today with only plastic fittings installed it would only warrent a C3 so that in itself suggests it is not dangerous.

I think @essex has it spot on.