Please can anyone help a DIY guy? ...CH problem.... | Page 2 | on ElectriciansForums

Discuss Please can anyone help a DIY guy? ...CH problem.... in the Central Heating Systems area at ElectriciansForums.net

This is what is connected to my boiler and it connects the orange of the 3 port to Neutral.

Not sure why its connected but cant see how this would solve the above problem.

Are you 100% sure you have 230v on both the white and grey wires as you said that when calling for both HW and CH it works fine so the motor is working as it is driving to the centre position and being held!
 
You said quite specficically that the PUMP does not run when demand is only for heating. Does the boiler fire up? Is the pump wired in parallel with the boiler or via an overrun thermostat in the boiler?

With the head disconnected from the system and the white and grey wires both fed with 230V (CH call, HW sat) the actuator should complete its travel and make the orange wire live. If this is not happening, the actuator appears to be faulty.
 
That looks similar to what Honeywell sent me Tony. Also fitted between Orange/Boiler SW and Neutral. It solved my problem but not sure why to be perfectly honest. Everything was wired correctly but every time you replaced the head on the valve it would damage it and you wouldn't get 230v on the Orange.
 
Ah, OK. I've not seen this done before and I am not sure why it is done. The orange lead on a 3-port has two functions. When there is call for heating but not for water, the valve moves to the far position and a contact completes a circuit from white to orange to feed the boiler / pump. The only function the capacitor might have in relation to this is as a suppressor to reduce arcing at the microswitch when switching the boiler/pump load. I would be surprised if the microswitch would fail rapidly without it, unless they have started using very weedy microswitches or the present generation of mid-position valves actually use a solid-state switching alternative to a microswitch (It's years since I looked inside one, perhaps someone could confirm?) Personally I would use a snubber with built-in resistor for that purpose and the only reason to add it outside the valve would be if the one built into the valve was inadequate for certain loads. Mention of the pump overrun would suggest that the switching device in the valve is being damaged by the pump motor being dumped back on the orange lead and creating a transient after running from the boiler PL via the overrun thermostat.

There is another sneaky function for the orange lead, which is to backfeed the demagnetisation resistor in the valve when there is call for hot water via the normally-closed contact in the cylinder stat. The small resulting AC current in the winding is supposed to avoid the situation where, if the valve has been sat at the mid-position for a long time with DC flowing through the motor via the stall diode, the stator becomes slightly magnetised preventing the spring spinning the motor back to the rest position once the call for heat via the white lead is removed. There is a minor side-effect if the valve is in the far position when this happens: The valve stays put because grey is still live and current flows via the demagnetisation resistor back out of the orange lead. I can see a possibility that if this is used to control boiler electronics via an input that is unduly sensitive, the 1mA or so from the orange lead might cause unwanted triggering. The capacitor would provide a load to absorb that, however it would not damage the valve so I don't see that this is the reason.

If anyone can confirm or deny whether modern 3-ports have a triac or something controlling the orange lead, that might shed some light on it.
 
Well people, I've solved it.
I decided that if all the connections were present and correct, and that all the valves, components and so on were ok, then it must be the wiring itself. What I found was that one wire from the programmer to the wiring centre was fractured and had intermittent contact. It's the one that turned the pump and valve on when heating was called for.
SOLVED!!!!
Thank you all so much for your help!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
If it was the diverter valve then the boiler and pump would still fire up. As they don't it has to be programmer or thermostat.
 
Not if there is a break in the HW off cable!

If the controller is calling for heating and not HW and only the white wire has 230v and the grey wire is not getting 230v the valve will not drive across putting 230v on the orange to fire the boiler and pump up.
 

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