Solar Panels - cables loose on roof?

[farmerdave]

Um yes - that is the case - it isn't sideways on! Although there isn't too much space above and below the inverter, it's in a space that extends sideways and is near a bit of roofspace that is very well ventilated.

 

[Earthstore]

Oh dear, Tell me, if you had a plumber to do work on your house would you except this standard of workmanship?
Why they have installed your inverter in that position is beyond me, now you have a large hole in your stud wall, also cooling may be a problem.

 

[powervan]

inverta would be nice to have plenty of room around it but not always poss! i presume door and frame going over it so its not that bad! dust i presume is just behind cover so could be cleaned! cables well ive seen worse! your issue is distance of brackets i think! all other probs easily corrected!! still big shame u missed deadline!!

 

[whinmoor]

Well, we generally leave something like 25cm clearance on all sides around our inverters. I expect (but don’t know for sure) that Fronius expect something similar. Maybe someone can confirm?
That plaster or sawdust or whatever isn’t very attractive. Add to the list of complaints.
Difficult to see much on the roof except the cables shouldn’t be resting on the slates like that. I can see 5, maybe 6 brackets on the right (bottom?) rail which probably isn’t enough for 8 panels in a windy area.
In summary, it’s looking like a pretty shoddy job.

 

[Gavin A]

I guess he didn't rotate the photo, Gavin :teeth_smile:

oh erm yeah I suppose that's fairly obvious now I look at it again.

 

[farmerdave]

Thanks for all of your comments. I'll go back and try to measure bracket spacings and have drafted an email detailing the shortcomings to the company concerned. I'll get back to you with their response!

The house isn't finished yet - the hole in the wall will be made into a nice hatch with a door on it - fortunately we have an excellent joiner!

 

[farmerdave]

Right oh,
I've had a measure, and for those that like hard facts (sorry, should prob have put this in the op):

We have a 16 panel array, 2 rows of 8 panels
Panels are 1640 x 992 mm ET Polycrystaline
They're mounted on 4 rails (2 per row)
Each rail appears to be attached to the roof by 7 brackets (28 brackets in total)
I can get to one end of the lower row via a handy velux:
Its around 0.7m from the edge of the row to the first bracket
Brackets appear to be 1.2m apart.

How does that sound in an exposed location in the far N of England?

The brackets being around 1.2m apart suggests they might be joist-mounted, rather than being attached to slate lats, but I'll ask the supplier the question.

There is a bit of knocking in moderate winds, but what that's due to I have no idea (maybe brackets on roof or slate, maybe row to row banging). It's the problem of the supplier to sort out - I'll bring it to their attention.

Thanks, Dave

 

[dansk]

Very good point. We received a circular from Gemserv Ltd (MCS Licensee) dated 28th Feb which included the following:

"Note that regardless of the circumstances, once an installation is properly commissioned according to the MCS standards, it is not permitted under the Scheme or the Code to
withhold the MCS certificate from the customer, regardless of whether they owe you money"

Your installer should have received the same and now you know it. It sounds, however, that it hasn't been "properly commissioned according to the MCS standards" so this doesn't yet apply.

;-) knew i had seen it recently, but couldnt ref it.

@Gavin Yes fair point.

 

[moggy1968]

It's a pretty shabby job to be honest!!
You don't just bash holes with a hammer in a plasterborad wall, you use a saw.

The Fronius IGTL inverter requires 200mm free space on either side for the cool air vent to the left and warm air outlet to the right. It should be mounted on a 'stable vertical wall'
Also, where it is installed in closed environment, as your intending it is 'necessary to make sure that the hot air that develops will be discharged by forced ventilation'
I would take that to mean a fan. Thats straight out of the Fronius manual, which your installer should have left with you.

Aditionally your array should be earthed. It is a transformerless inverter and the array can be touched from a velux window. You should be able to see a green and yellow 10mm earth running from the rails to either the main earth or a spike in the ground, depending on your supply earthing type.

We would fix brackets at 1200mm intervals on a bungalow down here in the south. Where you are I would say that is inadequate, but I haven't done the calcs for your area, maybe a northern installer can advise on that.

If your installer unlawfully witheld your cert, as suggested above, then I would suggest you would have a case against them for any resulting losses.

 

[powervan]

Ventilation via fan!! well they defo put in wrong place if its small space surrounded with celotex! ref brackets i BELIEVE 400mm from end of rail is MAX!!

 

[whinmoor]

Moggy's saying that 1200mm bracket spacings are fine on a bungalow in Dorset. I don't want to go out on a limb but the same may not be adequate for a house on a hill in rural Northumberland.
End brackets are clearly either missing or not in the right place. They need to be under the outside half of the panel at the very least.
Loose cables - discussed already.
Inverter location highly questionable.

Sounds like a right mess to me, I'm afraid.

 

[whinmoor]

Just wondering, you don't have to name and shame, but did you use a small local independent installer or one of the big national outfits?

 

[Eco Deal]

Very Bad installation.

Inverter in the most unstuitable poistion possible , why could they not of fiited a board to the plaster board wall , using the battens to get fixinging then mounted the inveter on the board ???

those MC4 ends need tie wraping up.

 

[dansk]

FYI - wind calcs need to be done, but on 4kwp array i would have expected more like 44'ish brackets.

 

[farmerdave]

Whinmoor, really tempting to name and shame, but I am kind of semi aware of libel/slander laws and know how a good/bad lawyer can twist the truth. Also, if the supplier doesn't give any joy, referring him to this thread is always an option!
Re. the inverter location, as with so many things involved in building a house, you find things out as you go along, and haad you known them at the start you might have done things differently. We have a largeish 'plant room' (boiler, manifolds, hot water tank, pressure set, fuses etc) which is where I'd naturally assumed that the inverter would go. The plant room is on the ground floor at the back of the house. Above that is a double height living room with the solar panels on the roof above. The supplier advised that this was too far to run the DC cables and that the inverter must be as close to the panels as possible (for electric shock risk). We don't ideally want it stuck in the corner of the living room so the options were either the very apex of the roof, with a hatch in, or behind a stud wall in the low bit of the roof, which we've done.

It's just one thing after another!