spur off a cooker circuit

[Mfctitch]

Hello everyone
new to this so please bear with me.
Was asked to supply an outlet for a washing machine in a kitchen with solid walls and solid floor.
I believe that the cooker should be on a dedicated circuit. My problem being that there are no other sockets on the same side of the wall.
Can anyone explain why I can not come off of the cooker circuit with a fused RCD and a single socket fitted to a double box. seeing as the cooker switch already incorporates a socket as well.

Thanks in advance for all advice.

 

[Absolute]

I also believe the cooker should be a dedicated circuit. I think what you say would work, but i wouldn't do it as i don't think it's the "done thing". A socket off the outlet for a gas cooker 13a plug is acceptable, but for a non "cooker outlet" maybe not

 

[Notsosmart]

Don't do it Titch, its bad practice at best.

Not ideal but any sockets on the other side of the wall?

Best way is to lift the floorboard above and extend the ring from the other sockets within the kitchen.

 

[act1988]

well I have to agree with absolute about it not being the done thing. But also you need to look at if it is a single/double over loading etc, you said the cooker switch has a socket also so that adds to the loading. what you are setting out to do is feasible but not really good practice.Another thing is that as the cooker switch has a socket on it alrdy surly the circuit should have rcd protection even if it was to 16th ed?

 

[lady electric]

Is it a socket outlet or just a double pole switch on the cooker?

 

[act1988]

he explained it as being a d/pole switch with socket.

 

[pushrod]

Appendix 15 of the brb 1(iii) says that cookers, ovens and hobs exceeding 2kw should be on their own circuit. However, this is informative only. So although not "best practice" if you assess the load characteristics correctly and rcd it as you described etc and label it as such at the CU i don't think it is a hanging offence

 

[lady electric]

oh yeah )

 

[Absolute]

Appendix 15 of the brb 1(iii) says that cookers, ovens and hobs exceeding 2kw should be on their own circuit. However, this is informative only. So although not "best practice" if you assess the load characteristics correctly and rcd it as you described etc and label it as such at the CU i don't think it is a hanging offence

Yep, and surely there isn't many cookers out there under 2 kW ?

 

[Paul.M]

I don't think you would be hung, drawn and quartered but don't forget that you are spurring from a 6mm cable to a 2.5mm so you need a FCU to protect the cable. Also needs a label to show that its on the cooker circuit and not the kitchen circuit, specially for maintenance so the next spark doesn't get fried thinking he has turned of the socket circuit when he/she hasn't.

 

[pushrod]

Yep, and surely there isn't many cookers out there under 2 kW ?

What it is saying is that if they are under 2kW then they can go on a plug top on a ring if it fits with manufacturers instructions.

It is quite acceptable to have a cooker switch with a 13A outlet (Possibly taking a 3kW kettle), since it is a solid floor and there are no alternatives, although not best practice, if it is done properly with a view to load assessments/cable capacity/installation methods etc etc to a single socket and labelled properly
at the CU i would see that as the best option. Would you rather that an extension lead was permanently trailing from the cooker switch or that it was done by bodgit and scarper?

 

[Notsosmart]

You need a FCU to protect the cable. .

Titch mentions that he is considering using one Paul, but I wouldn't do it myself

Also needs a label to show that its on the cooker circuit and not the kitchen circuit, specially for maintenance so the next spark doesn't get fried thinking he has turned of the socket circuit when he/she hasn't.

The first thing a sparky should do is to test the circuit you are working on to check it isn't live, but it is a valid point.

 

[Mfctitch]

Wow does anyone sleep on this site
The floor and ceiling are solid
As act1988 said yes it's a double pole switch with a socket.
The reason for fitting the fused RCD is that there are no RCD's fitted in the whole flat, and the cu is a nightmare.
The only other socket is cut into the wall so no chance of spurring off of that one, plus it's on the opposite wall with a window in between.

 

[pushrod]

I don't think you would be hung, drawn and quartered but don't forget that you are spurring from a 6mm cable to a 2.5mm so you need a FCU to protect the cable. Also needs a label to show that its on the cooker circuit and not the kitchen circuit, specially for maintenance so the next spark doesn't get fried thinking he has turned of the socket circuit when he/she hasn't.

OP has already said he would use an rcd fcu and i have stressed the need for labelling. I know it is not the way anyone would choose to do it, but done properly it is better than the probable alternatives

 

[act1988]

well to be able to add to that circuit in the first place you will need to test it but even if you are not going to be doing that i would suggest putting rcd protection on that particular circuit (if you are going to do it that way)