Storage

[The Solar King]

Incidentally, if you are going to buy the Cop, it is cheaper on Amazon than in the IET shop unless you are a member.

 

[SibertSolar]

I had a 25% discount code when I bought mine, SEUK2015, not sure if still valid though

 

[Worcester]

I had a 25% discount code when I bought mine, SEUK2015, not sure if still valid though

Thanks Andy, doesn't seem to be working (p'haps they don't like me ! )

 

[The Solar King]

The discount code expired on 31st October. I was trying to use this as well. Cheapest route would be to find an IET member to buy it for you........ Purchased a copy on Amazon for £53.40 as would waste more time than the money saved doing anything else.

 

[t4sltd]

Thanks for all of the above. I too was annoyed that the BRE guide refers to IET COP (which I never bought). Managed to blag a free copy as I provided input (which they ignored) - I questioned their requirement for bonding. I am an IET memebr if anyone wants a discounted copy posted to them get in touch.
As an interesting aside I have been added to reviewers for IET battery stroage COP and note that Martin Coterrell is now using a Tesla email address.

 

[t4sltd]

Re: calculations of costs for energy storage; you all have valid methods and points and the more you look at it the worse the business case. You are reliant on price inflation to get break even really.

I went to Wattsor training - they seem to know what they are doing and admit it doesn't really give a payback. Shame the first thing you have to do is move the house earth to an earth rod.

Went to Victron 'techncial' training with PV Kits Sales Manager who couldn't answer questions re: earthing or G83. He tried to prove that the Victron system would pay for itself within the 10 year 'lifetime' of the batteries but got his numbers wrong and failed.

Interesting to note that some suppliers don't feel the need for battery fuse / isolators in their kits.

 

[t4sltd]

I am currently investigating battery storage for future projects (grant funded) and have a few questions on legal compliance. I know its early days but would welcome guidance (and happy to share what I have learnt to date):
1) Using G83 kit we notify post installation (assuming export is under 16A)?
2) If in island mode (e.g. Victron) you need to break connection to suppliers earth? (and use a local earth?)
3) has anyone done a fire risk assesment for LiIon in a loft?!

 

[whinmoor]

Blog on VAT for Storage:

All Eco Energy Ltd | The Blog | Latest Solar PV News

 

[Worcester]

I am currently investigating battery storage for future projects (grant funded) and have a few questions on legal compliance. I know its early days but would welcome guidance (and happy to share what I have learnt to date):
1) Using G83 kit we notify post installation (assuming export is under 16A)?
2) If in island mode (e.g. Victron) you need to break connection to suppliers earth? (and use a local earth?)
3) has anyone done a fire risk assesment for LiIon in a loft?!

1) Only if the only generator on site, else theoretically G59, in practice a G83 PRIOR to install is needed.
2) Yes, that's what you do with all genny's. - Break all three, Line, Neutral and Earth.
3) Nope, we don't install inverters in lofts except as last resort (even moved one out to the garage the other day that was installed by a third party when we replaced it (faulty Mastervolt)

 

[The Solar King]

Attended a session on storage run by The Energy Savings Trust Scotland yesterday at West College in Glasgow. Had had some involvement in advising on speakers which resulted in Steve Pester from the BRE Solar Centre being there. As always he was very good , but had nowhere near enough time. Was also a Consultant from Delta Energy and Environment talking about the market. Even he could not get payback periods correct!

Of most importance was a conversation in a breakout session with the UK technical manager of Solaredge. He is also involved in dialogue with the DNOs via the Energy Networks Association.

There is mention in a thread on the other side about permissions. From his discussions he confirmed that at this point in time any AC connected battery storage system requires G59 permission to connect as the capacity is additional to that of the PV Inverter. There will be changes and clarifications announced in the coming months, but that is the current position.

DC connected systems like the Tesla (which Solaredge support) are unaffected as the inverter is still the limitation point.

 

[TedM]

Presume the G59 only applies if you are going above 16A per phase?

Good to see some common-sense prevailing, at least.

 

[The Solar King]

As I understand part of the problem is that AC side charge contoller/inverters are not G83 tested or certified.

 

[Gavin A]

As I understand part of the problem is that AC side charge contoller/inverters are not G83 tested or certified.

some are, but if done in addition to a 16A solar inverter to take the total above 16amps means they'd need to be G59 certified, which most aren't.

I'd be inclined to argue that the actual plant is still designed not to export more than 16amps to the grid - ie the DNC of the plant is still 16amps / 3680W.

 

[SolarCity]

Hmm, the G59 application seems like a pretty hefty barrier. Presumably a lot of sites will be rejected?

 

[The Solar King]

You may find these documents of use. they were referenced by a German guy doing training today on the Samsung Inverter/battery.

Can be used to calculate storage contribution etc from sizing. a bit to wade through and may be need to extrapolate away from 1000kWh/kWp used for output in calculation.

Thoughts on Samsung are it is a bit small having a usable battery capacity of only 3.24kW. Rating is also 2kW meaning it will only contribute to evening peak. Is well engineered and thought out but expensive at around £3.8K