SWA cables - fly leading armour as cpc??

[Pete999]

See I've always seen fly leading any armoured at supply end cpc or not as best practice. However Ive came to wonder if im wasting time as I seem to be coming across more and more sparks who don't bother with it....... "It's connected to a metal board"

Yes but has the connection between the enclosure and the SWA been done correctly? they don't teach this sort of thing in the training outfits do they, make an end off job done.

 

[snipersmith87]

Using the enclosure alone without flyleads can be bad depending on the construct of the enclosure/board, if you are terminating to a removable gland plate of a any metal that is not a solid part of the construct then a fly lead is needed as you will be relying on the (usually) self tappers that affix the plate to the rest of the box and you cannot say for sure if these screw which are usually paint on paint contacts will carry a fault current.
(There is nothing wrong with looping fly leads as long as its CSA can serve the largest circuit.)
This is why you don't need a banjo on metal conduit through boxes because they are a complete solid mold yet most gland plates would require them to ensure good earth fault return.
I would also add that even when glanding to solid constructs then without a flylead you have to ensure good contact and not poor contact to paint, IE using robust serrated washers or removing the paint prior to termination.

Are you saying just loop between the banjos to earth bar darkwood??? Aslong as biggest cpc size??

 

[Darkwood]

Yes, if you think about it that is what the earth bar is itself, you're just bringing that setup forward to the glands. I do it often, it is a lot neater than having 10+ flyleads to have one and several neat loops, it also means you can double/triple etc the banjo's to one bolt hole allowing both neater appearance and more glands per given space.

 

[snipersmith87]

Yes, if you think about it that is what the earth bar is itself, you're just bringing that setup forward to the glands. I do it often, it is a lot neater than having 10+ flyleads to have one and several neat loops, it also means you can double/triple etc the banjo's to one bolt hole allowing both neater appearance and more glands per given space.

I think I'm gonna go with this idea. Be much neater. Do you only link to earth armours and then separate fly leads for each armour acting as the cpc??? This is what I was aiming for by using more than one banjo per bolt/link.

 

[Darkwood]

I think I'm gonna go with this idea. Be much neater. Do you only link to earth armours and then separate fly leads for each armour acting as the cpc??? This is what I was aiming for by using more than one banjo per bolt/link.

It makes no difference the fact is the armour requires earthing so its makes no difference if the SWA is the earth or just been earthed, the method I describe is normal practice as long as you size you cpc fly-lead correctly to the largest circuit if looping.

 

[westward10]

In the past where it was required to several cables I fitted a copper bar across the lot, down the side of the board to the earth bolt and a link to the earth bar.

 

[elsparko]

i always take 3/4 strands of steel into the cpc connection aswell, what if the gland gets loosened off and some doughnut doesnt put it back on correctly?

 

[Bobster]

i always take 3/4 strands of steel into the cpc connection aswell, what if the gland gets loosened off and some doughnut doesnt put it back on correctly?

How are you doing that and following manufacturers instructions in using the glands?

Also i'm reading that as 3 to 4 stands rather than 3 quarters. In which case, will do nothing anyway.

Aside from this, have you ever seen a properly terminated SWA gland just loosen on it's own?

If I saw this practice on one of my jobs I'm afraid I would insist on having it remade.

 

[Pete999]

i always take 3/4 strands of steel into the cpc connection aswell, what if the gland gets loosened off and some doughnut doesnt put it back on correctly?

How do you manage to do that elsparko? just curious

 

[elsparko]

easy, just dont cut through 3/4 of the strands of steel, bring them in through the gland, rest glanded as normal, i was taught to do this by a guy who done mainly industrial, i said if someone loosened it off and removed it , then reglanded it without the steel strands it would at least still have some connection to earth.

 

[elsparko]

and yes i mean 3 or 4 not 3 quarters! lol

 

[elsparko]

i should add that it still has a frying pan and flying lead, aswell as the 3 or 4 strands, and a dedicated cpc.

worst case scenario i still want there to be some earthing to the steel wire

 

[Pete999]

How are you doing that and following manufacturers instructions in using the glands?

Also i'm reading that as 3 to 4 stands rather than 3 quarters. In which case, will do nothing anyway.

Aside from this, have you ever seen a properly terminated SWA gland just loosen on it's own?

If I saw this practice on one of my jobs I'm afraid I would insist on having it remade.

Yes agree Bob, with respect "elsparko" not really something I would ever do. Don't think that would comply with the Regulations. On a par with snipping a few strands from a conductor to get in into the terminal. IMO.

 

[Bobster]

It's a poor way of doing it an unfortunately as you've now no longer got evenly applied pressure all the way round the gland seat, it's actually more likely to come loose with vibration.

It would compromise the IP rating of certain glands also.

 

[elsparko]

Yes agree Bob, with respect "elsparko" not really something I would ever do. Don't think that would comply with the Regulations.

just what i was taught to do, if its not right id rather be corrected than carry on doing it wrong, which regulation out of interest?, do you guys just gland the steel, frying pan either side of fitting, then drill through, bolt the 2 frying pans together, then flying lead from inner frying pan?

i do all the above, just taking in a few strands also, my first boss was insisted on these strands being taken into the cpc, incase someone removed the entire gland then put it back in just hanging there, there would still at least be some protection on the steel wire

we worked mainly on farms, so maybe industrial was the wrong word to use, but same kit, seen plenty of farmers have a go at reglanding and it just sits there hanging by the connections, gland about 3 inches from unit

but as i said if taking these 3 or 4 strands is wrong id rather not be wasting my time with it either lol