Terrible work connected to my install.

[ajbelec]

Hi All,

This is my first post here, i've found this forum very helpful, so I'm hoping for some advice from those of you who may have been in my situation.

I have rewired a large house, including a sub main with 3 way board on the end of it for an air source heating system.

The problem I have is this - the 'defined scope' installer who has carried out the electrical work for the heating system has lashed it in.

For instance - SWA simply inserted into the board through 20mm knock out - no gland, the other end is in a PVC compression gland steel wire exposed. Therefore no earthing to armour.

No identification of cables, no isolator for boiler or immersion - oh and no labels on the board.

I don't really want to put this right myself, as it has been paid for already.

I haven't mentioned this situation to the client yet, I think I will first call the installer and 'ask when they intend to finish'.

Is it worth calling their governing body and asking them about it or am I just on a hiding to nothing?

I don't want this cr*p work on my job!!

All opinions welcomed.

Thanks,

Andy.

 

[High Tower]

Yeah i concur with CBW, i do exactly the same, when using 3 core i use the gray core slieved as cpc, and then only terminate the Swa at the supply end to afford fault protection, no reason other than preference and it cuts down on the amount of parralel paths

 

[hasel5]

Gray core as cpc sleeved no way. should be black as cpc and sleeved g/y grey as neutral and sleeved blue

 

[Knobhead]

I 'usually' earth one end as I am using 3 core SWA and use 1 core as the earth, or I do not wish to export a PME (NO NOT GOING THERE!!!!) Just my choice!

This is doing my head in now. You would only earth one end of a SWA and yet use a core as a CPC? Why waste a perfectly good earth return path?
If you installed an immersion heater would you cut all the copper pipes to the tank and install sections of plastic to avoid parallel earth paths?

 

[madmac]

Report the cowboy because you've raised it knowing it is wrong and you,as a qualified spark would never even think of doing a dangerous install. as this!!! Keeping it quiet is neglecting your duty as a qualified tradesman and protecting a dangerous cowboy who might never stop until an ordinary person is electrocuted and dies!!! Don't even think about giving yourself a guilt trip on this issue as it is so serious and he obviously couldn't give a ---- about killing some poor bugger!!!

 

[telectrix]

classic case of a little knowledge being dangerous. contact installer and advise them that their work is shoddy and you want it rectifying. offer to do it for them at your hourly rate x2.

 

[mogga]

classic case of a little knowledge being dangerous. contact installer and advise them that their work is shoddy and you want it rectifying. offer to do it for them at your hourly rate x2.

or if he hasnt been payed yet Advise coustomer that you have found these faults and will repair them allowing customer to withhold payment (or part payment)

 

[davelerave]

This is doing my head in now. You would only earth one end of a SWA and yet use a core as a CPC? Why waste a perfectly good earth return path?
If you installed an immersion heater would you cut all the copper pipes to the tank and install sections of plastic to avoid parallel earth paths?

don't think there is any problem paralleling armour and cpc -like you say there's parallel paths everywhere else


cpc's and trunking+conduit are paralled when the separate cpc is fitted

 

[Knobhead]

Not my post but I'll answer - One end only so that you don't get parrallel earth paths, thus needing twice the fault current to trip the circuit...

Think thats something like right, or atleast thats what my old guv'nor told me when I was an apprentice.

While I’m on my soapbox.

This one I can’t get my head around. Parallel paths require twice the fault current? I’ve never heard such tosh in my life. More like your old boss didn’t want to calculate the parallel path

For line to neutral, the fault current is “the fault current” it operates the protection no matter which way it goes. The ring main being the classic example.

If you’ve got an earth fault it’s got to be lead away to ground as efficiently as possible. I don’t care what rout it takes so long as it’s not though me.

 

[telectrix]

While I’m on my soapbox.

This one I can’t get my head around. Parallel paths require twice the fault current? I’ve never heard such tosh in my life. More like your old boss didn’t want to calculate the parallel path

For line to neutral, the fault current is “the fault current” it operates the protection no matter which way it goes. The ring main being the classic example.

If you’ve got an earth fault it’s got to be lead away to ground as efficiently as possible. I don’t care what rout it takes so long as it’s not though me.

sounds like your old gaffer has got his knickers in a twist. paralel pathe mean less resistance so will allow a larger fault current to flow, thus causing the protective device to trip quicker. not the other way round

sorry tony, was trying to repy to the post you were replying to, not your's.

 

[Ponty Massive]

So if that's the case, why only terminate the armourings at one end??

 

[telectrix]

only scenario i can think of is when supplying garage or shed, earthing armour ar source on TN, when TT at shed end.

 

[Ponty Massive]

only scenario i can think of is when supplying garage or shed, earthing armour ar source on TN, when TT at shed end.

same here !

 

[Engineer54]

While I’m on my soapbox.

This one I can’t get my head around. Parallel paths require twice the fault current? I’ve never heard such tosh in my life. More like your old boss didn’t want to calculate the parallel path

For line to neutral, the fault current is “the fault current” it operates the protection no matter which way it goes. The ring main being the classic example.

If you’ve got an earth fault it’s got to be lead away to ground as efficiently as possible. I don’t care what rout it takes so long as it’s not though me.

Sometimes Tony, the mind just boggles at where they get these strange idea's from. I'm pretty sure they don't know why they are doing it even!!! Makes you wonder if the old Boss didn't know either!! haha!!!

 

[telectrix]

some ideas are hard to shift, like old wives tales. e.g. feeding a dog raw meat gives them worms. NOT. and it' ain't so long ago the doctors bled patients, and still tell us that more tha 2 pints a day will shorten life. life without beer is not prolonged. it just seems that way.

 

[rob121]

Im glad I read this! Someone mentioned this to me a little while ago and I couldnt get my head around it. The job im doing at the moment for my NIC assessment is a barn conversion. Its a TT system from the house, then a supply is run to the garage in twin and earth, with no seperate earth in garage, then to the barn in 3 core SWA which ive put in, then from there to a kids playhouse/storage area in Swa 3 core which someone else had fitted. All the earthing went back to the one rod in the house. So I planned on putting seperate earth rods in garage, barn and kids play house. I had 2 electricians ive worked with to come out and give me some advice on the whole installation. This came up, 1 said only connect one end so they had seperate earths (when i asked him why he said he wasnt exactly sure why but mentioned ?PME?) and the other electrician whose been in the game longer and bit more clued up said connect them all together as you want the minimum amount of resistance, which made sense to me. Seems this has been cleared up as an old wives tale!