Testing before cu change

[Deleted member 9648]

We just add to the estimate that any faults which show up during essential tests carried out following a CU change will be rectified at additional cost....Never had any real problems yet,and cant ever remember a fault adding any more than 2-3 hrs to a job,usually a lot less.
Be bugg*%£ed if I'm going to waste my time doing a load of testing for naff all when I might not even get the job.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Can't believe some of the answers on this thread!

Chucking a board in with no testing and THEN testing.


Amazing!

Who are you registered with again

 

[ezzzekiel]

depends really,
if customer wants board change then your gonna have to fix any faults anyways so depending on the customers view of the options will give you an idea how to proceed. I used to offer a basic pir for xammount then deduct it from the completed job (as most testing would of been done by then) or if faults were found and customer wont proceed then you keep the pre agreed ammount.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Can't believe some of the answers on this thread!

Chucking a board in with no testing and THEN testing.


Amazing!

Who are you registered with again

There is no requirement in the Regulations to pre-test an installation other than to assess that the existing equipment is adequate for the safety measure intended to be used for the addition or alteration.
Once work has been completed, the requirement is only to inspect and test the work carried out, not the existing installation.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Its just the concept of fitting a board (that won't from then on stay switched on!) and then discussing testing. Just seems a touch bizarre....

In fact I'll put my neck out and say it's just wrong

Its a world of chancers. Because there will be many a time when it will pay off (i.e. close eyes, switch on, yes! both RCD's are still up!). But then what do you put on the cert?

Real results?

WHy not do them first then ?

 

[SPARTYKUS]

There is no requirement in the Regulations to pre-test an installation other than to assess that the existing equipment is adequate for the safety measure intended to be used for the addition or alteration.
Once work has been completed, the requirement is only to inspect and test the work carried out, not the existing installation.

Please see my next post (regarding red faced electrician in front of Board that doesn't work)

 

[Deleted member 26818]

As I said, there is no requirement in BS7671 to test the existing installation.
Myself, I'd rather first discuss with the client, why a board change has been decided upon. Then I&T the existing installation, before even agreeing to undertake the board change.
Often the reason for the board change, is that a delivery person from Curry's or B&Q has refused to install an appliance because the 'board is dangerous'.
Sometimes it's for convenience, and sometimes it's for safety.
I have on occasion persuaded a customer that a board change is in fact unecessary.
Probably not the ideal business plan, but I would feel that I am ripping people off, if they were not made aware of all of the facts and options.

 

[nikmet]

Its just the concept of fitting a board (that won't from then on stay switched on!) and then discussing testing. Just seems a touch bizarre....

In fact I'll put my neck out and say it's just wrong

Its a world of chancers. Because there will be many a time when it will pay off (i.e. close eyes, switch on, yes! both RCD's are still up!). But then what do you put on the cert?

Real results?

WHy not do them first then ?

Makes sense to do them first..............doesnt make sense to do them for free though, why shouldnt a customer be charged for this?

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Makes sense to do them first..............doesnt make sense to do them for free though, why shouldnt a customer be charged for this?

True enough nikmet, true enough! business is business.

 

[MarkieSparkie]

There is no requirement in the Regulations to pre-test an installation other than to assess that the existing equipment is adequate for the safety measure intended to be used for the addition or alteration.
Once work has been completed, the requirement is only to inspect and test the work carried out, not the existing installation.

I concur with your first paragraph Spin, however I prefer to PIR first and work from a known base, also most customers seem to like the professional approach and more likely to give me the follow on work.
When carrying out a board change you are changing the protective device of every circuit on the board and therefore you MUST test all the circuits on that board, as you are responsible for new fault and over current protection.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Its just the concept of fitting a board (that won't from then on stay switched on!) and then discussing testing. Just seems a touch bizarre....Tests are carried out DURING the CU change....as I already stated,that is made clear to the client in the esimate. Any faults which need to be sorted are sorted BEFORE energising. As I stated it is rare for faults to take more than an hour or so IF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. The only reason people have problems with CU changes is because they dont know how to fault find....witness the number of "RCD wont stay in after CU change" threads on here,if they cant sort it they shouldnt be changing a CU.

In fact I'll put my neck out and say it's just wrong ....Your approach is technically correct,but I live in the real world and refuse to carry out a PIR for nothing for a job I might not even get.

Its a world of chancers. Because there will be many a time when it will pay off (i.e. close eyes, switch on, yes! both RCD's are still up!). But then what do you put on the cert?....Do you not understand the concept of testing circuits before energising??....whether or not a "pre-survey PIR" is carried out before the CU change circuits need to be tested,and faults rectified....it makes no difference whether test results are obtained before or during a CU change to completing the cert.

Real results?..........????...why are real results only obtainable before a CU change?

WHy not do them first then ?.....because it's highly likely that I will be obtaining them FOC to the client, I have better things to do.

....................

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Please see my next post (regarding red faced electrician in front of Board that doesn't work)

The only red faced electricians are the ones who dont test BEFORE energising the CU....and dont know what to do if they have faults to rectify.
You seem to take the view that if a PIR is not carried out before the CU change,the only option is to turn on and hope for the best....it makes no difference when tests are carried out,they still have to be done before a new CU is energised.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

The only red faced electricians are the ones who dont test BEFORE energising the CU....and dont know what to do if they have faults to rectify.
You seem to take the view that if a PIR is not carried out before the CU change,the only option is to turn on and hope for the best....it makes no difference when tests are carried out,they still have to be done before a new CU is energised.

Oh dear!

You've misread wirepuller.

I am simply amazed at the number of replies that seem to infer exactly what you have tarred me with, the "turn on and hope for the best" bit. Not quite sure how you read my post inferring that.

We're singing from the same hymn sheet.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Oh dear!

You've misread wirepuller.

I am simply amazed at the number of replies that seem to infer exactly what you have tarred me with, the "turn on and hope for the best" bit. Not quite sure how you read my post inferring that.

We're singing from the same hymn sheet.

I don't see how we are singing from the same hymn sheet to be honest. I'm not sure if your advocating a full PIR check before a board change or test every circuit before a full board change, there is a difference.

I always tried to encourage a full PIR to be done if I considered the installation was old, had obvious alterations to it or if I felt by observation it looked "dodgy". This Personally I could ascertain within 30 minutes by looking at the installation, talking to the customer and taking a couple of switches and sockets off.

I always though advised them that I would deduct a large percentage of the CU change cost against the PIR cost and 9/10 that was fine. Remedial s after the PIR I would cover with the CU change quote.

If the client said no then I would outline that the CU change would be x amount, which is a day work, and if I went over that then fault finding would be extras at an hourly rate.

If the installation was IMO in good shape, no obvious problems, then I would not advised the PIR as such, I would say that it would be good to do one, but IMO not critical, and back myself to do the CU change and anything that bite me in within the day that I would set aside for the change.

I think it basically boils down to that intangible..........................experience, I just know when I walk into an installation be it domestic.commercial.industrial whether it is going to be a pig or not, yes sometimes it as come back to haunt me but mostly I think I'm right.

 

[richy3333]

Can't believe some of the answers on this thread!

Chucking a board in with no testing and THEN testing.


Amazing!

Who are you registered with again

Probably all NAPIT members