UPS specification for pool pumps

[Mike Johnson]

What safety concerns?
Why the emergency stop?
Pipe arrangements need work?
All the swimming pools I have been involved with re-start automatically once power is restored, it sounds as though the installation needs revising IMO.

 

[SJD]

What safety concerns?
Why the emergency stop?
Pipe arrangements need work?
All the swimming pools I have been involved with re-start automatically once power is restored, it sounds as though the installation needs revising IMO.

Some external safety review recommended adding an emergency stop, I suspect they thought someone might get sucked against a water intake, so one was installed. I've no idea whether this is a realistic concern or not, but not for me to question it!

Yes, I think the pipe arrangements are a problem, some pipework is above the pool and pump water levels. There are also quite a number of valves to allow things like backwashing of filters, filling, emptying. I think not all the pipework is fully water tight (there are minor leaks here and there).

However, the request is for a UPS to work with the system & pipework as it is, there is not the budget to revist these at this time, and beyond my expertise (I don't do anything that involves getting wet). It is a somewhat legacy system with alterations over time.

Possibly putting the pumps, boiler & any related items like dosing & monitoring on the one UPS. Given that the pumps run at approx 2kW, and the rest will takes less than 1kW, the total load is no more than 3kW. It only has to run for a short time for short outages (30 mins, perhaps even less).

My question is for people familiar with UPSs, do I just suggest a UPS rated at 3kW, or do I need to allow somewhat more to cope with pump start-up? Generally there will be mains power when the pumps are started, the UPS is just to keep them running, so possibly 3kW is sufficient?

 

[plugsandsparks]

Any UPS has to be the supply for the pumps, the grid runs behind it. Its the only real way of ensuring there is no interruption. a UPS can also be a grid conditioner and clean up a crappy grid. So your pumps start current will need to go through the UPS..... So any UPS you will need to check their specs for short duration current surge.

 

[Mike Johnson]

This sound like a very amateur bodge up DIY pool, personally it would give me the jitters on what else has been bodged, think I would walk away.

 

[SJD]

Any UPS has to be the supply for the pumps, the grid runs behind it. Its the only real way of ensuring there is no interruption. a UPS can also be a grid conditioner and clean up a crappy grid. So your pumps start current will need to go through the UPS..... So any UPS you will need to check their specs for short duration current surge.

Ahh yes, of course, thanks.

 

[SJD]

This sound like a very amateur bodge up DIY pool, personally it would give me the jitters on what else has been bodged, think I would walk away.

Professionally installed (I understand) some years ago, but perhaps not very well.

I quite agree that I'd prefer not to be involved, but do a lot of electrical work for the site and difficult to just say I can't help. Ideally I'd say get their pool company to specify what is needed, except they don't currently have one, just a plumber plus non-technical maintenance staff.

Edit: The more I think about this, perhaps I can have the site call a UPS supplier and give them the pump specs, then they get said UPS supplier to quote for a suitable model. At least then if the UPS proves insufficient, it won't be my problem!

 

[mainline]

Professionally installed (I understand) some years ago, but perhaps not very well.

I quite agree that I'd prefer not to be involved, but do a lot of electrical work for the site and difficult to just say I can't help. Ideally I'd say get their pool company to specify what is needed, except they don't currently have one, just a plumber plus non-technical maintenance staff.

Edit: The more I think about this, perhaps I can have the site call a UPS supplier and give them the pump specs, then they get said UPS supplier to quote for a suitable model. At least then if the UPS proves insufficient, it won't be my problem!

The both pools and spa where I work both have an alarm that also turns the pumps off and need to be manually reset, both are well sign posted, so I'm guessing it's a requirement for at least holiday lets. The spa and one pool I was directed to wire as such.

You could change the alarm button to a different type like push to break and twist to reset type ones, which would enable the pumps etc to restart after a power outage.

I wouldn't expect for airlocks to be a problem, as ours are often emptied of water when cleaning filters or using the vacuum pipe.

Another option is to use SMS device for monitoring and to maybe have remote reset.

The last thing I would be doing is using UPS i would be spending the money on repairing the leaky pipes.


Info:
Further detailed information on equipment such as slides can be found in the HSE
document referenced in the introduction.

Pool Outlets
In recent years there have been fatal accidents where persons, often young
children, have become trapped by the pressure on a pool outlet. It is important
that:
Where possible, at least two outlets, spaced a minimum of two metres
Apart should be provided to the suction line.
Outlet covers are secure, kept in good condition and tamper-proof.
Outlet covers are visually checked daily. On a regular basis, someone should
Also dive to carry out a more thorough check.

Consideration should also be given to providing an emergency stop button that
shuts down circulation pumps and associated equipment. The most serious
accidents occur with pools with only one outlet. If you have one outlet you
must seek the advice of a pool specialist on methods that can reduce the risk of
entrapment.
Pool Grilles
Any grille openings in the pool must be designed to prevent limbs and fingers
getting trapped. The size of any aperture should not exceed 8 mm, if this
dimension is exceeded, you should obtain advice on replacing the grille

 

[SJD]

The last thing I would be doing is using UPS i would be spending the money on repairing the leaky pipes.

I'm inclined to agree. My understanding is only one of the pumps has an issue with air locks, the other one doesn't, so I'd want to know why this is. However, a relatively new maintenance guy on site seems convinced a UPS is the way to go, and seems to have convinced the others of this as well.

I will be at the site on this coming week for other work, and will raise some of the points in the thread. I'm probably going to suggest they try and get the opinion of a professional pool maintenance company.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Some external safety review recommended adding an emergency stop, I suspect they thought someone might get sucked against a water intake, so one was installed. I've no idea whether this is a realistic concern or not, but not for me to question it!

Yes, I think the pipe arrangements are a problem, some pipework is above the pool and pump water levels. There are also quite a number of valves to allow things like backwashing of filters, filling, emptying. I think not all the pipework is fully water tight (there are minor leaks here and there).

Some year back there was a case of a young girl killed by being sucked down to the bottom of a pool when being emptied through the power drain point, these are now illegal in public pools, nonetheless this was not the water intake or skimmers.

Pools do not have pipework above the water levels, backwashing, filtering and emptying are all controlled by a multi way valve at the filter/filters, as I said its a bodge job, I am walking away I suggest you do the same.