what is your preferred brand of consumer unit?

[Fin170]

Well Wilts are doing a board and 8 RCBOs for for £99 at the moment, the boards are huge and are made under contract by lewden, the RCBOs don't have the stupid functional earth either. I haven't used one yet but im tempted :drunk:

Denmens do the same ones, they're nice boards but I get the impression the RCBOs can't be up to much (although I've used a few with no issues, brand is 'control gear' iirc)

As for the 'functional earth' on a rcbo, here is MarkiwSparkie's post from another thread

1) In order for an RCBO to comply with BS EN 61009, the RCBO does not have to have a separate (functional) earth connection. However, the standard specifies that an RCBO which has a separate earth connection must behave in a certain way to conform to the specification, but the separate earth connection is not mandatory. There are RCBOs currently available that do not have a separate earth connection, yet they achieve full compliance and conformity with the standard.
2) The functional earth is used as reference by the internal RCBO electronics to increase the sensitivity, speed of operation and allows the device to detect an earth fault even if the neutral becomes disconnected. Losing the neutral connection is rare event, especially in TN systems that are increasingly common today. The probability of losing the neutral and having an earth fault at the same time, a double fault condition, is statistically small and evaluated by some manufacturers as so small not be of significance when specifying protection devices. In spite of this, there are those who advocate fitting an RCBO with separate earth connection “just to be on the safe side”. The penalties for this theoretical risk are RCBOs with taller form factors and the extra connection which make consumer units and distribution boards cramped and harder to wire, pushing up required connection time and costs. Even worse some electricians don’t know how to terminate RCBOs and it is quite common to find RCBOs with the functional earth connections cut off, this is clearly bad practice for a device where the electronics relies on a earth reference for its sensitivity and speed of operation.
3) Most manufacturers of RCBOs with functional earth fly-leads insist that these leads must be disconnected during insulation testing to avoid damage to the sensitive electronics, and during earth impedance loop testing to avoid misleading results. A minority of manufacturers insist on the disconnection of the neutral fly-lead during testing in addition to the functional earth, it is therefore important to consult manufacturers instructions before testing. Removing and replacing connections adds to the time and cost of testing, however, there are other issues. First, there is the possibility of failing to reconnect the functional earth fly-lead, leaving the device operating under conditions other than those for which is was designed. Secondly, disconnecting fly-leads goes against one of the basic principles of installation testing, which is that the installation should be tested in the exactly the same state as it will be operated in service. However, we often break this aspiration in installation testing.

tl;dr if they got one they're likely better :lol:

 

[D80]

Don't really mind usually, I dislike Hager stuff a lot. Have had more than one of them that I can't get a bloody RCBO to fit into, new board and all there stuff why the f**k can't it fit!

Crabtree starbreaker I've worked on once, but no bloody wholesaler here stocks or can (wants more like) get breakers for it. Square D has had that style of setup for years though. The Merlin stuff with the slide lock I like, especially in 3 phase as you don't take the cover off just to have potential death looking at you. Not sure which ranges Schneider are carrying on though.

I'd prefer to use 1 type of board and then keep the stock for it, but its never that simple. The biggest issue I have is I can test an RCD of any make, I can't test an MCB.

As for reliabilty the old Wylex stuff is great. Their rewireable and 1361 fused range with 30mA RCD's stood the test of time. Yet to come across a faulty RCD from that era, which is a lot more than can be said of the modern day stuff!

 

[sparc]

Well Wilts are doing a board and 8 RCBOs for for £99 at the moment, the boards are huge and are made under contract by lewden, the RCBOs don't have the stupid functional earth either. I haven't used one yet but im tempted :drunk:

You've got to wonder how anyone is justifying charging £25-35 for an RCBO. Granted they need to go through more rigorous testing than an MCB, but they've been around for years, and don't exactly contain any technologies younger than 50 years.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

D80 so true, loads of faulty 'modern' RCDs/RCCBs, not one older one.


Fastest disconnecting recorded, an old WYLEX 'brick' as main isolator. Under 5mS

 

[Poptasticdave]

Wylex and crabtree are the only brands I ever used when I was doing the job full time. Liked OLD old MK sentry (New in 1979 catalogue and used through 1980's / 90's), but won't ever touch them again after seeing the one a very good sparky fitted at my mum's new in 2010 - so flimsy and bendy that I can't quite believe they are up to regs!

 

[SPARTYKUS]

You've got to wonder how anyone is justifying charging £25-35 for an RCBO. Granted they need to go through more rigorous testing than an MCB, but they've been around for years, and don't exactly contain any technologies younger than 50 years.

They justify it by looking through the new range rover catalogue first.

 

[richy3333]

the front was so floppy I had to use 3 hands to get it to line up!

OO-er. I have the same problem

 

[t-s]

hager 6+6, if customer will pay for it :/

 

[Rauer]

It ain't exactly expensive!!

 

[SparkySupplier]

You've got to wonder how anyone is justifying charging £25-35 for an RCBO. Granted they need to go through more rigorous testing than an MCB, but they've been around for years, and don't exactly contain any technologies younger than 50 years.

When you really think about it, these guys save lives. £25-£35 is a small price to pay to ensure the safety of human life. The customer pays for it anyway. 9 times out of 10 if you explain what an RCBO's role actually is against an MCB, they will want RCBO's and be grateful you pointed this out to them. I always, always, always install RCBO's, unless the customer is adamant they want MCB's.

 

[MDJ]

When you really think about it, these guys save lives. £25-£35 is a small price to pay to ensure the safety of human life. The customer pays for it anyway. 9 times out of 10 if you explain what an RCBO's role actually is against an MCB, they will want RCBO's and be grateful you pointed this out to them. I always, always, always install RCBO's, unless the customer is adamant they want MCB's.

Customers have blinkers on when it comes to safety, the amount of times I have been called to a house to wire up a new cooker and I get there and a 25kw range is waiting for me to connect up, the existing cable is a 6mm2 and it is connected to a 3036 board on a tns system where the earth clamp around the incomming cable has disintergrated and the ze 2 ohms or something to that effect and the range cost 1500 quid. When you tell them you cannot connect it and why then the cost they suddenly have kittens, they are happy to fork out 1500 quid for an appliance but alarmed to spend half again on safety lol.

 

[hillbillie]

RCBOs are getting cheaper and cheaper now. One of my wholesalers gets me them for £13.50 + VAT, with the main switch CU at £24; pretty good when you compare it to 3 or 4 years back. I'm finding it easier and easier to convince the customers to get RCBO boards rather than a dual RCD.

 

[sparc]

When you really think about it, these guys save lives. £25-£35 is a small price to pay to ensure the safety of human life. The customer pays for it anyway. 9 times out of 10 if you explain what an RCBO's role actually is against an MCB, they will want RCBO's and be grateful you pointed this out to them. I always, always, always install RCBO's, unless the customer is adamant they want MCB's.

Not arguing with safety value of the RCBO - just the price point. Wilts is still doing a 15 way board with 8 RCBO and a MS for £99, or less than £15 per. The same board with standard priced RCBOs would cost over twice that. I get some customers that want a 'Rolls-Royce' solution. Most don't want to pay over £100 for a board - bit will happily pay £500 for a new TV. I can sort of understand that - you may never see the advantage of having RCBOs in a box in a cupboard, but you can enjoy a new TV every day!

 

[Resu]

Thread is over a year old...

 

[sparc]

Thread is over a year old...

And your point, Resu, is ... ?