12v Downlighters hot

[Spiceman]

Hello everybody. Could somebody give me some advice on the following please.

Installed downlighters in my bathroom about 10 years ago which have been working fine. At the time of installation I made sure the loft insulation was not surrounding no where near my lights due to the heat that they output.

Im now re-insultating my loft and wondered how I go about covering the lights with insulation? I have seen like these fire proof covers in screwfix and metal shields but I thought they were quite expensive. Then I noticed they now supply these 12v lamps and label them as coolfit.

Could anybody point me in the right direction in to what would be suitable so I can totally cover my lights with insulation.

Thanks Tony.

 

[Davey101]

I've used sections of large plastic soil pipe placed over the downlight and cut to just above the level of the insulation.Personally I wouldnt want to cover any type of downlight with insulation.

No, nor me.

Why not? What about LED downlighters?
Is putting plastic pipe near a downlighter a good idea? I've heard of empty water pipes have holes burnt in them by downlighters before.

 

[bramboy]

jcc rep. says insulation can go over down lights, but as long as it doesn`t get tucked in tight to joists.

Taken with a pinch of salt thou, when their 12 volt fire rated down lights came out they would melt the wires in the fittinig if the wrong lamp was inserted. Ok if the people never moved house who knew the problem. But any custumer will always put the cheapest lamp in place as long as it fits.

megaman 11w is my prefered option near insulation / plastic ceiling

plant pots are good thou...

 

[harrymonkfish]

the electrical safety council published an interesting article this month entitled 'Downlighters can they be a fire hazard?'

see here: Downlighters can they be a fire hazard? | Electrical Safety Council

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Why not? What about LED downlighters?
Is putting plastic pipe near a downlighter a good idea? I've heard of empty water pipes have holes burnt in them by downlighters before.

The pipe we have used has been of sufficient diameter to sit over the downlight with plenty of air space and there have been no problems. We have done this on several rewires where there is no existing loft insulation and we were informed that it was to be installed at a later date after we had completed.These insulation clowns cover everything in sight with 12" of fibreglass,when they did my fathers they covered over the C/H pump!
Regarding LED downlights I guess they would be ok covered....but low energy CFL's still generate heat and I wouldnt want to cover them.

 

[jimmyjazz]

the electrical safety council published an interesting article this month entitled 'Downlighters can they be a fire hazard?'

see here: Downlighters can they be a fire hazard? | Electrical Safety Council

As they say 'watch this space'

 

[martysparky]

Ha that sounds kind of interesting but flower pots have holes??

I was instructed in my Part P that insulation should be avoided over cables and lights as that small area of sacrifice would be more advisable than affecting the current carrying capacity and any fir risk.

Best Practice Guides | Electrical Safety Council

 

[bugsy]

The cool fit lamps are specified for fire rated downlighters so as to avoid too much heat buid up in the fitting and triggering the intumescent, covering them with a high degree of insulation could null the effect

Aurora do a range to overcome this problem - Aurora Sola Aurora Home Page

 

[haj]

Hi guys Auora now do a Downlight range designed to be covered with insulation I bet there expensive though . Regards Haj

 

[martysparky]

What about the cables going to these lights?
reg: 523.7 Cables in Thermal insulation.

Where a cable is to be run in a space to which thermal insulation is likely to be provided, the cable is - wherever practicable - to be fixed in a position where it will not be covered by the thermal insulation.

 

[Colonel Hathi]

Hi
I thought that the "coolfit/" lamps actually reflected heat back into the space behind the fitting?
Isn't the idea that the beam of light is cool (at the expense of the space above the fitting being hotter)?

Am I getting confused

CH

 

[bugsy]

Hi
I thought that the "coolfit/" lamps actually reflected heat back into the space behind the fitting?
Isn't the idea that the beam of light is cool (at the expense of the space above the fitting being hotter)?

Am I getting confused

CH

Cool fit dissapate the heat and light forward , they are the only lamps recommened for fire rated D/L

 

[Colonel Hathi]

Thanks for the clarification - I realise now that I was thinking of "coolBEAM" lamps

CH

 

[andrew692003]

I've used plant pots for years! Perfect for keeping insulation or any other debris of the light fittings and no problems so far. Just buy the pots with the hole in the pot, Usually around about a £1 to buy. I don't think there's anything 'rough' about that, your saving the customer a lot of money instead of buying Firehoods or Firerated fittings.

By the way I would only install the flower pots in a loft or where you had access to them, anything between floors its Firerated for me and usually Robus or JCC! I've noticed the JCC lights actually sit better to the roof than the Robus type.

Cheers

 

[bugsy]

Lost the plot with this thread, are we talking about keeping the ceilings fire rating properties or just supporting the insulation

 

[rocker]

Been looking at these rip off fire hoods and to be fair I reckon a clay pot with a hole in the bottom (or top, as the case may be) would be much more effective. Regarding the insulation itself, to be honest I would cut a hole in the insulation whether it was a fire rated downlight, fire hood or clay pot. There is always going to be heat coming out of the top of the hood, and to be fair with a fire rated/hood you are going to get a large build up of heat being concentrated out of its hole. Not good.

It's not going to affect the insulation anyway, if you think about it these things are builty to withstand 1000c or more for 60 minutes, the 20-odd degrees going up to your ceiling is going to be no match for it...

So in a nutshell, fire-rate them AND cut the insulation, that's what I would do anyway.