17th or RCBO DB?

[ash_s3]

Just wondered what people's thoughts are on this.

Got a nice little board change to do, appeared to be your usual Wylex 3036 6 way, but the property only has 3 circuits Cooker, Ring final, and Lights (1bed flat)

Would you install a small split load 17th board like a 6 way BG (3+3) or go with a main switch enclosure with RCBOs? Cost is about the same, maybe RCBO option a few quid more.

Im swaying towards the RCBO option but it makes future upgrades more costly with the price of RCBOs over MCBs.

Cheers

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Too right boydy.blinkin' freezers....

 

[Guest125]

So it would appear that there are many many times we all do not use RCDs. At the beginning of this thread I was told off for making an installation 'less safe' and it now appears as if non RCD circuits do have a place. Which was my point.

 

[ImpededLoop]

So it would appear that there are many many times we all do not use RCDs. At the beginning of this thread I was told off for making an installation 'less safe' and it now appears as if non RCD circuits do have a place. Which was my point.

After a while on here you get to know who to trust and those that don't have quite such an in depth knowledge.

 

[D Skelton]

So it would appear that there are many many times we all do not use RCDs. At the beginning of this thread I was told off for making an installation 'less safe' and it now appears as if non RCD circuits do have a place. Which was my point.

The industry is unfortunately saturated with people who cannot; A. Think for themselves, and B. Interpret regulations correctly. This thread is testament to this.

RCDs are sadly the main topic of some of today's worst electrical old wives tales and mostly because of the fact that there are now so many out there doing this job who simply don't have a clue, that the RCD is just seen as a sort of magical device that, no matter what the state of the circuit, will make it comply if fitted.

Me personally, I think RCDs have their place and their uses, but in nine out of every ten situations I come across them, they're a bleedin' nuisance!

In theory, if an installation is carried out well, an RCD should never be needed. Their constant presence as 'idiot proofing' devices annoys me considerably. It was never what they were intended to do.

 

[Guest125]

The industry is unfortunately saturated with people who cannot; A. Think for themselves, and B. Interpret regulations correctly. This thread is testament to this.

RCDs are sadly the main topic of some of today's worst electrical old wives tales and mostly because of the fact that there are now so many out there doing this job who simply don't have a clue, that the RCD is just seen as a sort of magical device that, no matter what the state of the circuit, will make it comply if fitted.

Me personally, I think RCDs have their place and their uses, but in nine out of every ten situations I come across them, they're a bleedin' nuisance!

In theory, if an installation is carried out well, an RCD should never be needed. Their constant presence as 'idiot proofing' devices annoys me considerably. It was never what they were intended to do.

I don't think we can avoid sockets on RCDs, especially in a domestic setting. But you are correct in that some people do not understand when they are required and just insist on RCDing everything. It is more dangerous to have a little old lady fumbling around in the dark because a light has taken out half the house and she goes arse over --- trying to get to the board. This needs to be in our thoughts when deciding RCD protection.

Furthermore, I would say that installing RCD protection to circuits that do not require it would breach regulation 531-02-04 which says that circuits should be sub-divided so that nuisance tripping will not occur.

 

[Guest125]

You need to consult your BGB, as that regulation refers to earth leakage and RCD protected circuits.

You are referring to section 314 of the BGB.

I am sorry but what is a BGB?

 

[Plonker 3]

Big Green Book, or the latest copy of BS7671

 

[Guest125]

Big Green Book, or the latest copy of BS7671

That reg says: "A residual current device shall be so selected and the electrical circuits so subdivided that any protective conductor current which may be expected to occur during normal operation of the connected loads will be unlikely to cause unnecessary tripping of the device."

So, my reading into this that if you select to put a circuit that does not require RCD protection on the RCD part of a board then you are NOT meeting this regulation as the circuit that you are putting on the RCD could cause nuisance tripping.

 

[Plonker 3]

That reg says: "A residual current device shall be so selected and the electrical circuits so subdivided that any protective conductor current which may be expected to occur during normal operation of the connected loads will be unlikely to cause unnecessary tripping of the device."

So, my reading into this that if you select to put a circuit that does not require RCD protection on the RCD part of a board then you are NOT meeting this regulation as the circuit that you are putting on the RCD could cause nuisance tripping.

That is te key statment, please re read it and tell me what you think it means by what i have highlighted.

 

[Guest125]

That is te key statment, please re read it and tell me what you think it means by what i have highlighted.

So earth leakage cannot occur on a lighting circuit no?

 

[Plonker 3]

i would be quite concerned if it happens in usual useage on the circuit. If it was to occur then designing the circuit so its not RCD/RCBO protected would be the best way to install it.

But section 314 which I mentioned earlier is what concerns division of the installation

 

[Engineer54]

Had the same setup myself a few years back- chest freezer.

That's what i was thinking he was talking about, a non RCD protected outlet for a freezer in the garage!! lol!!

 

[ash_s3]

Went for a Main switch DB with RCBOs in the end, wholesaler did the RCBOs for £11.50+Vat each and the DB for £23+Vat.

Lewden/Control gear direct, looks good enough for the money.

Thanks for everyone's input

 

[uksparks]

So it would appear that there are many many times we all do not use RCDs. At the beginning of this thread I was told off for making an installation 'less safe' and it now appears as if non RCD circuits do have a place. Which was my point.

You do make a valid point, I wouldn't say its less safe, just with an RCD it adds another layer or additional protection. I do agree though, there are certain situations where an RCD is not required or will cause more of an issue, but without looking this thread was about changing an old board for new was it not? I think ill just end this for me with, if I am changing old for new, then it will have RCDs or RCBO's but ultimately will be protected.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Went for a Main switch DB with RCBOs in the end, wholesaler did the RCBOs for £11.50+Vat each and the DB for £23+Vat.

Lewden/Control gear direct, looks good enough for the money.

Thanks for everyone's input

Used that stuff for years, seems very good, never had a failure, out of the box or later, had plenty with more expensive more well known makes......

however it it is missing the fly lead to earth which is a slight disadvantage. But we're splitting hairs a bit.