Adding a light to a circuit with no earth

[robo83]

Got to quote a job where the existing circuit does not have an earth.

It's swapping a pendant for 3 Downlights.

The board was changed about 2 yrs ago and has labels indicating no CPC on lighting.

All Fascias are plastic. Where do I stand Regards this, I understand you can accept no CPC on lighting with Fascias but not sure about modifying the circuit.

 

[Ian1981]

The downlights your installing will need to be class 2 rated of course.
Is it in a bathroom?

 

[Spoon]

How hard would it be to add a 4mm earth?

 

[robo83]

It's in a kitchen.

 

[Wilko]

My thought is to look in CU and see if cct starts with cpc in earth bar, then look at the cable inco to pendant, it might just be cut back ? (optimistic me)

 

[Octopus]

Class 2 downlights and a decent note on the cert.

 

[Midwest]

Can't see that you can. If you are adding new wiring, reg 411.3.1.1 'A cpc shall be run to & terminated at each point in wiring & at each accessory except a lamp holder having no exposed conductive parts.....'.

If it was the case of just replacing luminaires, Class 2 and note etc.

 

[Ian1981]

Can't see that you can. If you are adding new wiring, reg 411.3.1.1 'A cpc shall be run to & terminated at each point in wiring & at each accessory except a lamp holder having no exposed conductive parts.....'.

If it was the case of just replacing luminaires, Class 2 and note etc.

A cpc will be ran in by the op I would imagine if altering installing new wiring to luminaries.
Granted it may not do anything but a class 2 luminar will have no exposed conductive parts so the wiring will be no more dangerous than previous with a relivant note on a MWC

 

[Midwest]

A cpc will be ran in by the op I would imagine if altering installing new wiring to luminaries.

That's the issue, the way I read the OP's post?

 

[Ian1981]

That's the issue, the way I read the OP's post?

Yeah no cpc to existing circuit db is labelled as such.
However if installing class 2 there is no exposed conductive parts so a fault to the enclosure cannot give a person an electric shock by touching it.
Wiring hopefully covered for overload and short circuit protection by a adequate protective device.
I don't see a problem with it as long as it's clearly identified at the db which it is.
Also note the MWC

Obviously class 1 luminaries are a no no unless a cpc is installed from the db perhaps

 

[Andy78]

A cpc will be ran in by the op I would imagine if altering installing new wiring to luminaries.
Granted it may not do anything but a class 2 luminar will have no exposed conductive parts so the wiring will be no more dangerous than previous with a relivant note on a MWC

The definition of a cpc is a conductor that is connected to the MET.
So I would read 411.3.1.1 as each point requires a conductor that is connected to earth.
612.2.1 requires that continuity of protective conductors is carried out during testing.
132.16 requires that all existing equipment and arrangements are suitable for safe alteration before the work is carried out.

I would personally not extend a circuit with no cpc.

 

[Spoon]

I don't think he is extending the circuit. Just swapping lights.

It's swapping a pendant for 3 Downlights.

 

[Midwest]

Yeah no cpc to existing circuit db is labelled as such.
However if installing class 2 there is no exposed conductive parts so a fault to the enclosure cannot give a person an electric shock by touching it.
Wiring hopefully covered for overload and short circuit protection by a adequate protective device.
I don't see a problem with it as long as it's clearly identified at the db which it is.
Also note the MWC

Obviously class 1 luminaries are a no no unless a cpc is installed from the db perhaps

That's not the way I read the reg; new wiring, cpc to each terminated point.

 

[Karin]

1 Pendant to 3 downlights.. so +2 points extension to the circuit?

 

[Spoon]

1 Pendant to 3 downlights.. so +2 points extension to the circuit?

Balls....
I read it as 1 pendant to another fitting with 3 lights on... My fault....

I'm sure the OP will clarify all this...