Any loxone partners on here

[bigspark17]

any ef members a registered loxone partner? Just after some info about them and there partner scheme

 

[stummish]

I'm not, but I nearly did. I talked to Joanna I think she was called, but decided it didn't suit me. Upfront cost for materials to train with, pay for a week long course and then become a "partner". There's a few platinum partners that will basically get all the work worth doing by default, they shut their support forums down so unless you know their system inside out, you have to rely on a tech support hot line.

If you do loxone installs how they require you to as part of their guarantee, that house is then stuck with it until it gets rewired, so if loxone goes under and theres a problem, tough sh*t. If it needs modifying and loxone dont exist anymore, tough sh*t. The parts are insanely expensive for what they actually are. If the mini server crashes or breaks, you can't even turn a light or the heating on.

I went with z-wave (fibaro in particular) mainly because they have open forums, the kit isn't bank breaking, they don't force you into any courses, and if fibaro go under, other zwave suppliers like vera or qubino etc still work, not tied down to 1 brand. The main reason for me though is if the zwave controller crashes the house still works like a normal house, it just looses it's "smart", and you can remove the zwave parts and it'd back to being a normal house.

 

[charlie76]

I have to agree with @stummish , I looked at loxone and it seemed that they just wanted a bag load of money off you to learn how to use their products and get some demo kit and then more money to get a better level of partnering i.e. silver, gold, platinum etc... I just don't agree with paying that much money to someone for me to sell their products, they should be after your trade not you paying them for the privilege of promoting them....

 

[bigspark17]

Thanks @stummish & @charlie76 . Great feedback. You have hammered home my thoughts i spoke with joanna too and didnt agree you had to pay to train pay to become partner, they should be throwing stuff at you as we would be frontline selling to homeowners. The z-wave sounds better and the fact it continues to work if the server crashes is a big bonus. How easy is it to retrofit the zwave into an existing house or fit in a new extension?

 

[stummish]

Retro fit is easy. If the lights are loop in at the switch you can put the modules in the switch box, it's a struggle in a 25mm box but it can be done. If it's loop at the Rose then you need to lift a floorboard (or use one of them armeg hole cutters with the metal plates on a chipboard floor) to put the module in a wiska box (or similar).

It's not just for lighting, if you want to control it, zwave can do it. Cctv, velux/fakro windows and blinds, TVs, security, locks... the list is always growing. Good place to have a look at what modules are available is Latest Z-Wave Products at Affordable Prices | Vesternet - http://www.vesternet.com/smart-home/technologies/z-wave

 

[peterl3986]

Hello,

I am a Loxone registered partner, I have found that Loxone are very helpful and the course was very good as I learnt a lot about working with there system. There is also the networking side of things as you get to meet a lot of new people and pick up a lot of info from them and there experiences. As I'm an engineer by trade I found there experiences interesting and learnt a few new things too.

I don't believe the course is for everyone as some people will not like the programming side of the install. This is the side I prefer but not every bodies cup of tea.

You can contact partners in your area and they should be able to give you more info and there names can be found on the Loxone site. I don't know anything about the other types of system the other members are talking about but I believe the system is very good but that's just my own opinion.

I believe if you want a smart home then you want a complete smart home and not a normal home which can be set up to be smart. (my opinion) but as for miniserver crashing I worked with them a lot on the course and never once did they crash even with us constantly loading and reloading info onto them.

This type of system is exactly like a PLC system which are fitted in many factories and once set up then they are extremely reliable.

Peter

 

[tlsambo]

We did become a Loxone partner. Wasted our money. Forum was useful but as members talked about linking it with non-loxone products, (which was a point Loxone used to sell it) Loxone shut the forum. With support only being available M-F 9-5 and problems not occurring at such convenient times and the support webpages being very basic and often out of date we've really struggled to deal with the issues we've had.
The last straw was when we got involved with a developer, introduced Loxone and Loxone then dealt direct and cut us out.

 

[AJshep]

I do work for a company that is a Loxone Partner. I've never been on the course myself but ended up doing the complete job from wiring, programmng and building the Panels myself, and I kinda self taught myself. The only thing I don't know is how to do send IP commands.

The system itself is very good you can do so much, however to get the full benefits of the system the customer really needs to be technical themselves or have an endless supply of money to pay for and installer to tweak it to the customers needs.
One of the installs we did was quite large and we have had to go back a few times once for a sticking relay on the PLC and twice to upgrade the firmware on the Loxone intercom. ( no fault of ours) It gets to be a bit of a pain.

Another problem is when they update their app and the customer gets confused and it costs you another trip to try and explain the new interface.

Loxone has a place in the market, if I were looking to be a partner myself I would be very careful who I sold it too. If you keep it basic ( simple light scenes/ music) you can make money. If you make it more complex then you may find it becomes a pain in the bum.
The bigger company's I've observed seem to price for basic programming so they can charge extra for changing the config.

I'm also looking at Zwave devices and controllers/gateways as I think this is probably a more cost effective approach. And with these systems the user can tweak their own set-ups.
Just got to persuade the wife to let me buy a few devices...
Maybe we should start a thread on Gateways/Smarthubs ?

Another note I did notice Loxone Air operates at the same frequency (868mhz i think) as Z-wave in Europe.

 

[egg67]

Have fitted a couple of them, did think about going on the courses but if you look at the program as virtual rather than Physical it is Actually easy to program and you do not need to go on a £500 coarse to lean how to do it,never had a problem with the installations as was all set up to customer spek, do not like the fact they say you need to keep a mini sever in the van just in case you custom one go’ s ---- up, as for the prices they charge just look on the wedsite at the tool kit all you need in one bag, but for that money you would have thought you would get a heated leather case

 

[AJshep]

Have fitted a couple of them, did think about going on the courses but if you look at the program as virtual rather than Physical it is Actually easy to program do not like the fact they say you need to keep a mini sever in the van just in case you custom one go’ s ---- up

I agree with you it's not that hard go program, I quite enjoy it.
My Employer (who did the course) missed the point about the spare minisever and we had a micro SD card fail on us. I was driving around frantically late one friday looking for a local Tescos to grab a new one..
Glad you mentioned it as that is really another important piece of advice to mention for anyone using Loxone, As flash media does have a limited lifespan and after so many rw cycles your SDcard will fail. Suppose that's why they say keep a backup, also noticed on the new config update they give you the chance to optimize the config, again probably also done to extend the life of your SDcard.

 

[egg67]

It was more to the point that they said you should have a spear mini sever in van just in case the mini sever goes titsup , my way of thinking is the mini sever should not go titsup and you do not need to have Hundreds of pounds of mini sever sitting in van that you have paid for, as for as for SD card you always have a pre programmed one in the control panel next to all paper work just in case, saying that I have not had to go back to the ones I did for about 3 years now so must work and still go for drinks at one of the places and is still all good.
Just do not like the way the company works, went for a meeting with them to discuss a project which I had all ready Designed and they added about £1,000 of extra stuff that was not needed and not wonted, then Tried to sell my a £500 Demo case and Sign me up for the Courses.
Think they need to change the way they think

 

[tlsambo]

Paying for courses & demo cases wouldn't be such a rub if they helped you out a bit more. As anyone can buy the kit and they stitched our company up by cutting us out then it doesn't matter about the system's capability so much as the way they treat you.

 

[stummish]

I've installed zwave systems for years now, the only problems have been 1 sticky relay out of who knows how many, and 1 unusually complicated lua script which was beyond my limited programming skill. Replaced the sticky relay in about 45mins, paid a guy to debug and fix my script, then I uploaded it to customers controller remotely.

No system is perfect, the all have their costs and adavntages/disadvantages. There are issues zwave has which are well documented in forums, along with fixes or workarounds. A lot of my problem with other systems (loxone being just one of) is how closed down the community is, and how the companies that run them portray an image of simplicity and perfection while twisting your balls for every penny at every chance.

 

[AJshep]

Out of interest @stummish what z-wave controllers have you used, thinking of gradually doing something out at home ?

 

[stummish]

I've used vera edge, vera plus, fibaro home center lite, fibaro home center 2 and samsung smartthings.

Smartthings is easy but very basic and limited, wouldn't recommend.

Vera is cheap, but it has its limits. Requires a bit more knowledge/research to get what you want happening. I used this in my home until I got a fibaro hc2 refurbished to replace it.

Fibaro is the dogs danglers with cream and sprinkles (enjoy that mental image for a second or 2!). Comparitvely expensive, but works great, looks great, easy to use, but can do all the complex stuff too if you require (hc2 only for lua scripts).