Cable Routing help required.

[Richlizard]

Hi all.

This is my first post for advice, so please take it easy on me. I am a recently qualified electrician on a completely new career change and have soon realised that qualifications mean nothing at all compared to the experience that no doubt you guys have built up over the years.

I am presented with a perfect opportunity as my friend has bought a house where the wiring leaves a lot to be desired. Another friend is dealing with the larger issues like changing the fuse board to a new consumer unit and I have taken on the role of what should be a simpler job of new light fittings and moving sockets around, etc.

I only had a quick 20 minutes to look around, but this is what I observed.

They currently have no light switch cables buried into the wall and sockets are a mixture of little mini double sockets and some so big you could house a hamster inside. Most rooms have spurs and homemade extensions made to look like it is part of the ring, but obviously not. So a lot of work to be carried out.

The first room they want done in a hurry is their lounge which has presented me with my first issue which I hope you can help with.

One side of the chimney breast they have this tiny double socket which they want moved to the other side of the chimney breast. This is on an external side wall...

I don't know how the cable was routed, but as you can see there is a 'spur' cable running to the other side of the chimney breast. I doubt very much it was legit or safe how it is routed or even how it is wired direct into the socket, but on the other side of the chimney breast was this giant great ugly lump that I assume is just some kind of glorified extension lead??

Obviously that lump will be removed from the current socket and they want two double sockets in this area to replace it. So I want to extend the ring from one side to the other. I thought it was obvious that all I needed to do was go to the floorboards above and run it around the chimney breast beneath the floorboards and chase it back down the other side. When I went upstairs, facing the same external wall, I found that the right hand side of the breast was in a bedroom as shown here...

When I got the floorboard up, I was expecting to see the two cable disappearing down through a hole and chased into the wall...

But they seemed to go through a beam, almost as if going outside but obviously not. So I am struggling a little to see how I will get them up and out... or even confirm where they are going. They seem to be in the correct place, but can only see them aiming to the external wall through this beam. I would assume the hole was drilled into this beam and the cabling pushed through and down into the channel in the wall. I don't suppose this is an issue. If I can't pull them back out again (if needed), I would just cut them off as they don't want this socket any more. It is not an issue to channel out the wall as obviously the plaster will be in at some stage.

My real problem arrives next. The left hand side of the chimney breast upstairs is in the bathroom next door... somewhere!

As you can see, the left hand side of the chimney breast and the cavity I was expecting to see so I could run the cables down the external wall is not there. It is all filled in and tiled. The floor is also tiled.

So I am at a bit of a loss how to get the cable from one side of the chimney breast to the other.
There are no other sockets from that side of the room to run from. Obviously I don't want to run cabling across or through the chimney breast. The floor is concrete (wood effect vinyl) and I was considering channelling out along the floor, but not sure of the pros and cons of that.

So there you go.

Sorry it is a little long-winded but I am hoping someone has had this exact scenario and there is a simple solution.

I very much appreciate your help and any suggestions.

 

[sparksburnout]

With respect, would you not be better knocking this job on the head, and seeing if you can get some work with a local sparks as a mate? I know your friend is ill but if he is "going to change the CU" he should have done some basic tests first, 30 years exp or not. Even house bashing can be quite testing if you don't know your way around! You can't keep asking very basic questions every time you meet situations like this, you need to get some experience.

 

[westward10]

Thanks. Are you saying to try to run the cable along the joist? Which I would assume passes through the chimney breast? Won't this be a heat hazard if within the chimney breast, albeit behind a joist?

But even if I manage that... there is no 'other side' from upstairs. Take a look at the bathroom image.

I may be misreading you here.

Think I am misreading your pics, I thought the picture showed the cables dropping down to the "tiny" socket.
I don't think I have ever fitted one of those "tiny" MK sockets.
Shame you can't get some on site help from one of us, well maybe not me so you can bash some ideas about.

 

[telectrix]

surprised this has not been suggested. if flooring above is tiled/laminate/whatever , not to be damaged, cut the bloody ceiling. easy repair and a muck=spreader to skim after.

 

[hightower]

Haven't read every post. But there's two ways to do this as I see it. The first is what @telectrix suggests - open the ceiling up. The second is chase around the top of the wall - within the 150mm zone - to get where you need to be, and then down to the accessory. There's no doubt a mess needs to be made one way or another.

 

[westward10]

Haven't read every post. But there's two ways to do this as I see it. The first is what @telectrix suggests - open the ceiling up. The second is chase around the top of the wall - within the 150mm zone - to get where you need to be, and then down to the accessory. There's no doubt a mess needs to be made one way or another.

You then have the problem of jointing the cables because they won't be long enough.

 

[Richlizard]

I think youre beginning to think. Of course it does depend on what way the joist run sometimes miraculously you can rod a cable through. I would be careful about where you locate the socket as it can be a pain trying to plug things in where that one is now.But at regs height it will be better. Depends where they are going to put equipment. But if they want to sell later then both alcoves will benefit. And usually there is a lot of sockets needed due to the plethora of equipment people want to plug in. Draw a plan of the whole ground floor and where sockets are needed then join the dots with your cable and work out the route.

Haha, well yes believe it or not I have given it tons of 'think'. Bloody keeps me awake at night.

But I am still confused how you can rod your way along the beam which runs into the chimney breast as it will surely give a heat issue?

And when it gets to the other side of the breast, I cannot actually access it as it is in a blocked off area in the bathroom as shown in the bathroom image.

Downstairs is simple once the cable is in place. Two sockets the other side of the breast and a double socket diagonally across the room. I would probably persuade them to keep the existing socket in fairness as it makes no sense to remove it. So both alcoves would have power... one day!

 

[Richlizard]

Haven't read every post. But there's two ways to do this as I see it. The first is what @telectrix suggests - open the ceiling up. The second is chase around the top of the wall - within the 150mm zone - to get where you need to be, and then down to the accessory. There's no doubt a mess needs to be made one way or another.

I have made it very clear it will be a total building site.

Presumably you mean to chase all the way round the 150mm zone and not across the top of the chimney breast? So almost a full lap of the room?

 

[The Ghost]

Ok you can not go through a chimney breast end of, there is no beam in a chimney breast you are going to go around it somehow.

 

[Octopus]

You need your experienced mate all the way..


You may be desperate for work but this could be as complete and utter nightmare.

And if it's going to be a compete building site why don't you just recommend a compete rewire...It's probably for the best

 

[Richlizard]

With respect, would you not be better knocking this job on the head, and seeing if you can get some work with a local sparks as a mate? I know your friend is ill but if he is "going to change the CU" he should have done some basic tests first, 30 years exp or not. Even house bashing can be quite testing if you don't know your way around! You can't keep asking very basic questions every time you meet situations like this, you need to get some experience.

I do lots of work with two local electricians. For over a year now. I also work for myself but survive on basics.

This would have normally been classed as 'basic' when I agreed to help him. Now it seems there is a lot more to it and I appreciate all the comments. In a way, it is probably a good thing the bathroom is blocked off or I would have already got stuck in [blush]

 

[Richlizard]

You need your experienced mate all the way..


You may be desperate for work but this could be as complete and utter nightmare.

And if it's going to be a compete building site why don't you just recommend a compete rewire...It's probably for the best

I am not offended one bit, but I don't actually need to work at all so not desperate. I just want to work. I enjoy it and love to help people.

I have mentioned there may be a requirement for a complete rewire which may end up cheaper in the long run.

 

[sparksburnout]

I do lots of work with two local electricians. For over a year now. I also work for myself but survive on basics.

This would have normally been classed as 'basic' when I agreed to help him. Now it seems there is a lot more to it and I appreciate all the comments. In a way, it is probably a good thing the bathroom is blocked off or I would have already got stuck in [blush]

I am struggling to stop my Avatar commenting, it might get him banned.

 

[Octopus]

I am struggling to stop my Avatar commenting, it might get him banned.

If you were your avatar you would say it.....

 

[telectrix]

anycomment from ozzy should be treatedwith the respect it fu**in' deserves.

 

[Pete999]

I am struggling to stop my Avatar commenting, it might get him banned.

Sharron