Consumer unit ...which way to go?

[Chris86]

Afternoon all,

Early in the new year, I have the need to leave the comfort of the industrial world and take on a rare domestic job (rewire of my brothers new house)

Its a 4 bed house and to get it how he eventually wants it, a CU with plenty of room for expansion is a must. As usual though, budget is tight so I am trying to source a CU at a reasonable price. Work wise for 3 phase, we use either Hager or Schneider acti9 but the domestic versions of these will prove a bridge too far as will going all rcbo.

I have so far found a British General 22 module high integity unit and a Wylex 21 module high integrity unit, both of which will fit the bill future proofing wise but and there is always a but, are either of these any good and if you had to choose between them, which way would you swing?

Thanks in advance for any opinions/advice.

ATB

Chris

 

[Chris86]

My work will be safe and comply fully with the regs. As long as I know that and the council have their paperwork in order then that should be everyone happy.

I am not some clueless diyer trying to do a trained spark out of a job, I have a 4 year apprenticeship behind me, C&G & NVQ qualifications, 17th regs and years of working in the industrial sector, a house rewire may not be my bread and butter but I am confident I can take it on and send the council inspector away happy.

ATB

Chris

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

some councils prefer the electrical bodies option. the inspector working for the council will not be niceic or eca elecsa have said before no third party testing .but good luck what ever you do .

You might be surprised, Around this way the council send the building control sign offs to electrical contractors the council are happy with, normally jib graded, apprentice time served sparks, often Niceic approved contractors in there own business. but when signing off for building control purposes they assume the hat of council inspector so scheme membership and rules is not so important as they have the councils building control inspectors authority for the inspection.

 

[Chris86]

Speaking to a few lads on the circuit around Brum, that's how I believe Birmingham city council do it.

 

[pirate]

Just to echo Murdoch, when you look at the price of the house, the kitchen and bathroom(s) and the load factors, a proper installation is a minor cost, and is where money should be spent initally, planning for the future. Add the induction hob and range cookers, UFH and spa-baths later...knowing your installation is ready and waiting and fit for purpose. Would you spend £100s of thousands on the house itself, then not pay a few quid more to insure it? Sorry for the mini-rant, but the emphasis is all wrong when it is the gloss and glitz that matters,not the foundations.
However, to some degree it's all about educating the client. In a former life, if the client wouldn't take my advice, I sent them away...sometimes they reconsidered and returned, and long-term relationships were formed. One thing I have learned from this forum is that so many of you professional sparks really believe in the "start strong from the ground up" theory. Clients will ask for all sorts of fancy stuff they can see and show off, but suggest you might have to bust a bit of plasterboard/lift some floorboards etc and they go ape-----...at the cost and the mess.
Let's buy a fast powerboat, but no lifejackets...

 

[Midwest]

My work will be safe and comply fully with the regs. As long as I know that and the council have their paperwork in order then that should be everyone happy.

I am not some clueless diyer trying to do a trained spark out of a job, I have a 4 year apprenticeship behind me, C&G & NVQ qualifications, 17th regs and years of working in the industrial sector, a house rewire may not be my bread and butter but I am confident I can take it on and send the council inspector away happy.

ATB

Chris

As Gavin alluded to, convince your LBC of your competency & qualification, and save the £252.

'What are the requirements of Part P? As of 1 January 2005 it is a legal requirement for all work on fixed electrical installations in dwellings and associated buildings to comply with relevant standards. The relevant UK standard is BS 7671:2008, 'Requirements for electrical installations' (The IEE Wiring Regulations 17th Edition). BS 7671 covers requirements for design, installation, inspection, testing, verification and certification'. (citation IET).

If you can design, install, inspect & test to the requirements of BS7671, you are complying with Part P. Have a read of 3.9 Part P, and see what you think?

Someone posted this link a while back; Electrician Competence Recognition - The IET - http://www.------.org/policy/collaboration/sa4e/index.cfm
suggesting that's what LBC's use to assess someone's competency in such situations. No idea if that's true.

Worth a punt though, then your brother-in-law could have that shiny Hager CU

 

[Chris86]

Thanks for the above link, made interesting reading. I thought I would stand no chance without the testing and inspection qualification but it may well be worth asking the question.

In an ideal world, I would be installing a hager all rcbo board and i will be doing my best to convince him of the benefits of this. Sadly though, not everyone can be convinced and I am not in a position to just walk away because he prefers the Wylex unit.

ATB

Chris

 

[Octopus]

In an ideal world, I would be installing a hager all rcbo board and i will be doing my best to convince him of the benefits of this. Sadly though, not everyone can be convinced and I am not in a position to just walk away because he prefers the Wylex unit.

ATB

Chris

How many circuits are you planning to install?

with the dual board, he will lose half the circuits when the RCD trips, its not a case of if it trips, its WHEN it trips.

I've lost track of the money I've made due to dual boards tripping and customers needing the house fixed as quickly as possible as they can't cope with 1/2 the circuits missing.

Pre AMD3 I had been installing high integrity boards, post AMD3 - RCBOs only.....

I bet he has money for the nice kitchen and bathroom - its all about priorities.........

 

[Midwest]

Thanks for the above link, made interesting reading. I thought I would stand no chance without the testing and inspection qualification but it may well be worth asking the question.

In an ideal world, I would be installing a hager all rcbo board and i will be doing my best to convince him of the benefits of this. Sadly though, not everyone can be convinced and I am not in a position to just walk away because he prefers the Wylex unit.

ATB

Chris

That might be a deal breaker, but still worth a go?

 

[Chris86]

As it stands at the moment, we are looking at 12 circuits. This may change depending on decisions for cooker and shower (My first look at the place is next Wednesday so will have a lot more idea by then) . I do want some spare capacity though.

I do not need any convincing as to the benefits of all rcbo, that would be my choice. There is no budget for kitchen or bathrooms at the moment, it' going to be a long project for him. First jobs are making the wiring safe and changing the windows, after that, it it will be working his backside off to save for kitchens and bathroom.

ATB

Chris

 

[Midwest]

Might wanna do some planning on that. Biggest one off the shelf from most of the manufacturers is 15 or 16 way (usable), before you start looking at bespoke stuff. Hager do some stacked ones, which I think you can get fairly easily, but as discussed, not in your price range.

 

[Spoon]

As it stands at the moment, we are looking at 12 circuits

Out of curiosity, what are the 12 circuits mate?

 

[Chris86]

As I mentioned earlier, I have not looked at the house yet, a viewer has been arranged for Wednesday so I can have a proper look. Going on discussions so far, the thinking is:

Ring final/radial for:
Kitchen
Utility/garage
Lounge/dining room/ hallway
Upstairs

Upstairs lighting
Downstairs lighting

Cooker supply (If required)
Shower supply (if required)
Smoke alarms
Supply to outbuilding
Supply for outside lights
1 extra way for the inevitable extra.

I know some of this could well be done away with by the time I see the job so I was just looking at worst case.

ATB

Chris

 

[telectrix]

this will do the job.

 

[Spoon]

Is it the norm to put smoke detectors on their own breaker?
I thought it was a good idea to put them on the lights, then if the breaker trips you will know.

 

[telectrix]

Is it the norm to put smoke detectors on their own breaker?
I thought it was a good idea to put them on the lights, then if the breaker trips you will know.

i always supply them from a lighting circuit. stops idiots from isolating them when they burn the toast.