Do electricians actually need to have the 17th Edition?

[John Lundrigan]

Hi All,
Just recently I have had my interest in electrical work re-awakened because I have a grandson halfway through his apprenticeship and I asked me for help.

The electrical technology was OK as very little of that has changed, but BS 7671 was new to me and so I got stuck into it. I developed some web based resources to assist me grandson and I felt I could make these available to others.

The problem for is that I am unsure of the real need for electricians to actually have BS 7671! It appears from other forums that electricians can work without actually having it. It seems that it is simply an advantage when looking for contracts. This seemed to be confirmed by the existence of Domestic Installer Schemes.

I would be grateful to any forum members who can clear up my confusion.

Thanks

Jonel

 

[Pete999]

Not being involved with Domestics, but I believe that you have to hold the 17th Qualification to become registered with a CPS. sure someone will confirm I'm sure.
Ask yourself the question would you let a motor mechanic or gas engineer do work for you without the latest updates and information with regards to their work?

 

[John Lundrigan]

Thank you for your very prompt reply.

No, of course I wouldn't let a motor mechanic do this work. But that seems to be what IS currently the state of the industry. From what I can gather, the CPS only require you to hold a copy of the BS 7671 and the same for a domestic installer.
It's very confusing trying to sort this out, but it does seem that there is no actual requirement to hold this qualification to be a practicing electrician!

Jonel

 

[Pete999]

Thank you for your very prompt reply.

No, of course I wouldn't let a motor mechanic do this work. But that seems to be what IS currently the state of the industry. From what I can gather, the CPS only require you to hold a copy of the BS 7671 and the same for a domestic installer.
It's very confusing trying to sort this out, but it does seem that there is no actual requirement to hold this qualification to be a practicing electrician!

Jonel

No worries Mate, as I said others will be on later and confirm or deny, I'm pretty sure of my facts though, but prepared to eat my words, I was trained with the 13th or was it the 14th time flies by. Your Grandson is lucky to have gained an Apprenticeship, who is it with out of interest? and wish him luck in his chosen career, it can be good to you, it was for me.

 

[FatAlan]

I think the issue with BS7671 is that you need to be conversant with and know your way around it. That’s what the open book exam tests you on. You are not expected to know it verbatim as practioners with different specialisms will use different sections for reference more than others. The standard is there for good reason and user friendly references like the onsite guide and overlaps with Part P and other building regs assist in making it user friendly.

 

[John Lundrigan]

Yes, that is the opinion I now have. I started looking at this topic from the wrong angle. I had this idea that it was a requirement for completion of the apprenticeship.
I appreciate that electricians 'dip' into those areas of BS 7671 that concern only what they are working on. But there is no requirement to confirm anybody's knowledge of the contents of this document such as C&G 2382.
Is there anyone for whom C&G would be essential?

Jonel

 

[Deleted member 26818]

No an Electrician does not need to hold the 17th edition to do electrical work.
However they do need it to obtain a JIB card, join a CPS scheme and in some instances obtain employment.
Something I don’t quite understand, is why some of the schemes require the exam for those who trained and qualified after the edition came into force

 

[Pete999]

No an Electrician does not need to hold the 17th edition to do electrical work.
However they do need it to obtain a JIB card, join a CPS scheme and in some instances obtain employment.
Something I don’t quite understand, is why some of the schemes require the exam for those who trained and qualified after the edition came into force

Thank you for your very prompt reply.

No, of course I wouldn't let a motor mechanic do this work. But that seems to be what IS currently the state of the industry. From what I can gather, the CPS only require you to hold a copy of the BS 7671 and the same for a domestic installer.
It's very confusing trying to sort this out, but it does seem that there is no actual requirement to hold this qualification to be a practicing electrician!

Jonel

I knew someone would come up with the goods

 

[John Lundrigan]

OK. But a Domestic Installer (belonging to a scheme) only has to have a copy of BS 7671, not certified in its contents.

Actually it also seems that a CPS scheme only requires a copy as well.

In fact, I've just had a look at the JIB card requirements and these seem to be mainly NVQ Level 3 Electrotechnology, but no need for anything like C&G 2382.
I'm hoping someone can tell me of anybody who really requires this certification.

Jonel

 

[Deleted member 26818]

You cannot obtain a JIB card without the 2382 and from past discussions with the NICEIC, they also require it.

 

[Pete999]

You cannot obtain a JIB card without the 2382 and from past discussions with the NICEIC, they also require it.

Thanks SL

 

[Deleted member 26818]

It does actually state on the ECS website:

In addition to the qualification requirements above the following is also required:

• A current Health & Safety Certificate or recognised H&S qualification. For details visit the ECS H&S test information area.

- and -

• A formal BS7671 qualification in the current edition of the wiring regulations (currently BS7671: 2008, 17th edition)

- and -

• Hold a current (up-to-date) Health & Safety Certificate or recognised H&S qualification. For details visit the ECS H&S Assessment page.

 

[telectrix]

i have a copy of the CAMRA Guide to Real Ale Pubs ( Cheshire) and can quote 95% verbatim. does that count?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Sorry no.
You need 97%.

 

[telectrix]

i'm working on it.