ELECSA assessment. Domestic+Periodic

[robsparx]

Hi, I am looking to register with ELECSA as a domestic installer soon, as I'm out of a job, and a few people want to send some private work my way. The domestic assessment sounds straight foward. Am i ok to complete a job eg. a rewire, then get it assessed and sign it off once my registration is complete?

And I am booked in to do my 2391 at the end of May. The ELECSA website states "It is agreed and generally accepted that an above average knowledge of electrical installations is required to carry out Periodic Inspections, usually gained through years of experience on top of formal qualifications (eg. C&G 2391)"

Well I have only recently come through my apprenticeship so would they see me as having enough experience to be carrying out periodics? I have had experience assisting with periodics on domestic properties, and hotels and schools whilst an apprentice, and then carrying out the remedials, so I feel i should know enough about what to look for in domestic properties

Sorry if thats a bit long winded

 

[TPES]

To join elecsa you will need some kind of regulations cert i think.
Idealy 17th regs level 3 cert 2382, if not 16th regs and need to upgrade to the 17th regs within your fist 12 mths of joining..

I think this a minimum needed by any of the scheme providers..

 

[sambuca2907]

To join elecsa you will need some kind of regulations cert i think.
Idealy 17th regs level 3 cert 2382, if not 16th regs and need to upgrade to the 17th regs within your fist 12 mths of joining..

I think this a minimum needed by any of the scheme providers..

Am talking about test and inspect quals - 2391 and 2392.

 

[sparkswillfly]

at the end of the day if you are competent in inspection and testing and can actualy do the job you should walk it as all the assessers know who can and who cant do the job within the first 5 minutes

 

[rob1967]

Hiya guys, Am I right in thinking that anyone who thinks they are competent and just do a PIR and hand a copy to the customer would be ok ???????

I have just completed my 3291 and am now in the position where everyone wants me to do some work for them ( with a cost of course ) but am still getting to grips with the mind field of all the regs thats involved, Can anyone advise????

What certs can I use and where can I get them from?

Seems like everyone just want to get there hands on your money to register with competent scemes and to register certs etc; etc..............

 

[electricAl]

First things first - get your Professional Indemnity insurance in place.

As for which certs to use, if your not attached to one of the Part P scheming bodies, download the BS7671 PIR sheets using the link provided above

(i assume you do mean 2391)

 

[Spudnik]

Download them from the IET.

Or buy some unbranded generic ones.

To use the scheme providers forms you must register to do PIR's with them. At a small fee, of course.

 

[rob1967]

So it is legal for me to do the PIR without the cert being registered with anyone other then me and the costumer?????

 

[Spudnik]

So it is legal for me to do the PIR without the cert being registered with anyone other then me and the costumer?????

Perfectly legal.

Its a sad fact that anyone qualified or not can carry out PIR's on generic forms.

One thing i would say is make sure you have sufficient PI insurance in place.

 

[rob1967]

This is the fuse board i'll be testing, any advice??? The rcd you see on the right hand side is for a shower................it's a TN-S system and the main earth is only a 4mm/ 6mm????

 

[Spudnik]

Well, from even just looking at the picture i could give you a list as long as your arm

 

[rob1967]

Well, from even just looking at the picture i could give you a list as long as your arm

Please do as I think I need all the help I can get lol................I have the cofidence to do any of the work but there's always somthing i'm likely to miss so any pointers will be very much appreciated

 

[electricAl]

You say you have the confidence to do any of the work... pardon me if i`ve got the wrong end of the stick but isn`t `the work` (in this case) the PIR you mentioned?

If, as you say, you believe your competent to do a Periodic, then i suggest you post what you see as non-compliances & then others can offer their opinions.

We all need a `little` help sometimes - after all, no-ones inflammable

 

[rob1967]

You say you have the confidence to do any of the work... pardon me if i`ve got the wrong end of the stick but isn`t `the work` (in this case) the PIR you mentioned?

If, as you say, you believe your competent to do a Periodic, then i suggest you post what you see as non-compliances & then others can offer their opinions.

We all need a `little` help sometimes - after all, no-ones inflammable

I do have the confidence to do the PIR as you can all tell that this install is no longer compliant.............Having 60A isolater...no RCD other then for the shower........etc, ect I am in the position to rectify any thing thats need doing, so just trying to go about doing the job in the least exspensive way as possible...so just looking for any thing that I haven't thought of

Upgrading the board to a new 17th ..........taking out the isolater and replacing it with a Rcd as a main swith ( in a class II enclouser ) for the whole installation and keeping the existing board providing it conforms to all the tests.

I got the comfidence to do it but experience is lacking I have to admit but I can't let that stop me doing what I have to do........which is why I'm here trying to get advice from the pro's rather then just rushing in and ballsing it all up... so advice would be very much appreciated after all Two haeds are better then one even if we are only sheep lol.....but in all seriousness any comments will be taken on board .........

 

[electricAl]

No offence intended atall Rob, so hopefully none taken your end.

But are you actually doing a pucka PIR, or doing a CU change, or doing a quick assessment ahead of a proposed install job. Your various comments leave me a little confused...

Firstly, altho you mention you do have a 2391 (& they don`t give those away) you haven`t instilled too much confidence with some of your remarks (e.g. Regs & minefield) No-one passes a Periodic exam without knowing BS7671 at least fairly well. We all have holes to our knowledge & i`ll gladly help you fill some of yours (& hopefully my own at the same time)

Likewise, if you`re Part P reg`d you`ll surely be familiar with most of the pertinent regs. If not, be aware what you`re gonna do will be notifiable. And as it was you who mentioned legalities a bit ago...

Lecture mode off

So, making the assumption that this work is for a PartyPee assessment we`ll all stick our noses in & make an obsevation or two...

Q. How sure are you that`s not an ELCB mate? Kind a looooks like one from the pic

Q. How sure are you that it`s a TN. The tails coming in plus that Volt op` RCB has me wondering see

Q. Have you actually seen the service head? The above will quickly be answered...


If, as you say it is TN then i`d suggest you get the DNO in to sort out those tails tother side of that isolator before you consider getting assessed on this job. Obviously you`ll do the rest with the Cu change.
Talking of which, forget the idea of the front end RCD - very non comp mate. No discrimination atall. You should already know that. If you get a true 17th board you won`t even need it. And if it does turn out to be a TT you can do without it too if you can do what table 41.1 states.

Anyhowsaround, i`ll leave it at that for fear of lecturing again

Sorry if it`s sounded more blah, blah than bah, bah but i`ve had me coat dyed pink today

Best regards, Al

 

[rob1967]

No offence intended atall Rob, so hopefully none taken your end.

But are you actually doing a pucka PIR, or doing a CU change, or doing a quick assessment ahead of a proposed install job. Your various comments leave me a little confused...

Firstly, altho you mention you do have a 2391 (& they don`t give those away) you haven`t instilled too much confidence with some of your remarks (e.g. Regs & minefield) No-one passes a Periodic exam without knowing BS7671 at least fairly well. We all have holes to our knowledge & i`ll gladly help you fill some of yours (& hopefully my own at the same time)

Likewise, if you`re Part P reg`d you`ll surely be familiar with most of the pertinent regs. If not, be aware what you`re gonna do will be notifiable. And as it was you who mentioned legalities a bit ago...

Lecture mode off

So, making the assumption that this work is for a PartyPee assessment we`ll all stick our noses in & make an obsevation or two...

Q. How sure are you that`s not an ELCB mate? Kind a looooks like one from the pic

Q. How sure are you that it`s a TN. The tails coming in plus that Volt op` RCB has me wondering see

Q. Have you actually seen the service head? The above will quickly be answered...


If, as you say it is TN then i`d suggest you get the DNO in to sort out those tails tother side of that isolator before you consider getting assessed on this job. Obviously you`ll do the rest with the Cu change.
Talking of which, forget the idea of the front end RCD - very non comp mate. No discrimination atall. You should already know that. If you get a true 17th board you won`t even need it. And if it does turn out to be a TT you can do without it too if you can do what table 41.1 states.

Anyhowsaround, i`ll leave it at that for fear of lecturing again

Sorry if it`s sounded more blah, blah than bah, bah but i`ve had me coat dyed pink today

Best regards, Al

Thanks for your reply and no offence was taken, life is to short to take offence besides advice is what I asked for and that is what I was given no matter in what form it takes lol .......

Im doing all of the above, quick assesment, and bringing it up to the 17th standards and a PIR after on the whole installation just to make sure ( Sorry for any confusion lol.....)

I have to many quilifications but not enough experience (2330-2...2330-3...2391....2382.....Part P VRQ level 2...) still have a lot to learn but want to do the job once and get it right first time.......
Was just looking for the cheapest option..it's defo a TN system and yes that is a ELCB but it's only rated at a 60A and the demand will be greater then that once the house is up and running again........
ELCBs are not recognised as a means of providing additional protection in BS7671 (2008) due to them requiring an earth as thay work by detecting a voltage to earth, the fault is driven throught the device and once it exceeds it's setting (50V) it would operate..........but most installs have had upgrades and the earth paths have been parrelled with the ELCB so making the ELCB ineffective.......