fire rated or not down lightd

[Simon-0116]

Looked at job for a builder to put down lights in soffit of a porch, single storey flat roof 2m x 2m. But void is only 80mm deep, told him he should have built it bigger but just says put them down lights in with no covers. My I dea was fireproof down lights, but not enough room. So as its outside, only one story do they need to be fireproof????

 

[pcam1984]

You could fit non fireproof and use led lamps to reduce the heat if there's not enough room for fire rated.

 

[sparky87]

hi simon, if it is hasn't got a habital room above then no requirement for fire rated fittings to be installed, is there insulation in void? and what is ceiling material? presuming internal not external? confused about sofit as this is the external overhang normally.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Aurora M5 LED Downlight IP65 Fixed 10W Fire Rated AU-FRL501

only 65mm in height.

 

[mansabadman]

Aurora M5 LED Downlight IP65 Fixed 10W Fire Rated AU-FRL501

only 65mm in height.

The Click Inceptor Micro Non-Dimmable 7W LED Downlight 4000K (LED4300WH7C) in a White finish is another quality product from Click. The Click Inceptor Micro Non-Dimmable 7W LED Downlight 4000K (LED4300WH7C) is available at electrical2go for only £15.


Or try these. A good led, very shallow above the ceiling.

 

[D Skelton]

Haler H2 are only 70mm high

Fire rated are only needed to maintain fire barriers. Typically, these will only be found between floors of separate properties, ie. in the ceiling of a ground floor flat. If there's no second floor flat then the downlights in the ceiling of the first floor flat need not be fire rated.

A lot of misinformation out there about when you need and don't need to maintain fire barriers.

 

[Leesparkykent]

The Click Inceptor Micro Non-Dimmable 7W LED Downlight 4000K (LED4300WH7C) in a White finish is another quality product from Click. The Click Inceptor Micro Non-Dimmable 7W LED Downlight 4000K (LED4300WH7C) is available at electrical2go for only £15.


Or try these. A good led, very shallow above the ceiling.

IF being fitted in a soffit outside though personally I would go with the Aurora as it has a better IP rating.

 

[TJ Anderson]

Haler H2 are only 70mm high

Fire rated are only needed to maintain fire barriers. Typically, these will only be found between floors of separate properties, ie. in the ceiling of a ground floor flat. If there's no second floor flat then the downlights in the ceiling of the first floor flat need not be fire rated.

A lot of misinformation out there about when you need and don't need to maintain fire barriers.

You also require fire rated in a standard two storey house. You would need this to maintain the 30 min rating of a standard plasterboard ceiling. http://www.downlights.co.uk/files/ESC-Fire-Rated-Downlights.pdf?334762691

 

[davesparks]

Planning Portal - Approved Document B - Fire safety: Volume 1 - Dwellinghouses

 

[Simon-0116]

Thanks for the quick genuine response, yes external soffits but always tried to fit fire rated before as a good practice measure. And correct that there are many misconception of fire rating rules, thanks

 

[GB.Kayak]

You also require fire rated in a standard two storey house. You would need this to maintain the 30 min rating of a standard plasterboard ceiling. http://www.downlights.co.uk/files/ESC-Fire-Rated-Downlights.pdf?334762691

TJ, thank you very much for the link to this document ... it should be mandatory reading for all professional electricians. Furthermore, I think that it provides insight into the reasons behind that much discussed and ill-liked BS 7671 amendment 3 provision for incombustible CUs.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Haler H2 are only 70mm high

Fire rated are only needed to maintain fire barriers. Typically, these will only be found between floors of separate properties, ie. in the ceiling of a ground floor flat. If there's no second floor flat then the downlights in the ceiling of the first floor flat need not be fire rated.

A lot of misinformation out there about when you need and don't need to maintain fire barriers.

There is a lot of misconception and I'm still not sure about whether or not they HAVE to be fitted in the ceiling if there is a roof space above. However, I will always fit fire rated ones when there is a loft above as this is recommended by 'Electrical safety first' in Best Practise Guide Number 5 - page 8 section 7.7 - (see link given by TJ in post 8). Their reasons are that this will:

1. Safeguard escape from the premises
2. Restrict the spread of fire.
3. Reduce the risk of premature failure of the roof structure

Also, The Electrical Safety Council recommends fire rated downlights fitted in 'all' ceilings' View attachment downlight information sheet- ESC.pdf

 

[davesparks]

Have a read of part B and you'll see that they are not required for ceilings when the only stricture above is a roof.

But I normally fit fire rated downlights everywhere because the fittings I use don't exist as a non fire rated fitting

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Have a read of part B and you'll see that they are not required for ceilings when the only stricture above is a roof.

But I normally fit fire rated downlights everywhere because the fittings I use don't exist as a non fire rated fitting

I've looked through the index Dave and also spent 5 mins scanning through the 86 pages but I cant see any mention of downlights. I'm not saying they're not there, I'm sure they are, I just cant find it! Do you know which page refers to the downlights and there situation in a ceiling with roof above?

ps.. Have also just done a search for the word 'downlights' and 'recessed' in Part B and nothing came up? Perhaps you are referring more to do with general requirements in a roof space rather than specifically anything to do with downlights?

 

[Andy78]

I've looked through the index Dave and also spent 5 mins scanning through the 86 pages but I cant see any mention of downlights. I'm not saying they're not there, I'm sure they are, I just cant find it! Do you know which page refers to the downlights and there situation in a ceiling with roof above?

That's because it doesn't mention downlights. It mentions fire ratings of ceilings in minutes, the situations in which they apply, and the need for reinstating such ratings if the ceilings are compromised.