Five fold increase in fusebox fires

[telectrix]

depends what the wires do.., or don't do if incorrectly installed.

 

[UNG]

No bee in my bonnet with you at all, just think (as somebody else has stated) you were rather quick to imply (not with words but you and others know what you meant)that Electrical Trainee are to blame for the five fold increase in cu fires.

In the last 5 or so years the quick training has been one of the major changes in the industry so must be implicated in some way in this statistic but without drilling down into the figures and providing a better analysis of the occurrences it is all speculation

The select committee thing, well your rather forceful here with words & views but on the day you were more Percival than Rommel & that is Just my view. Could I have done better? who knows but I didn't put myself up for it but you did , so hats off to you I suppose.

Overall the select committee meeting seemed very subdued on all parts and was gathering evidence to a time table that appeared to be set in stone. I assume there was some briefing beforehand as there appeared to be an amount of stage management. I think unless you had previous experience of the select committee workings any presentation of evidence was going to have some issues from what has been said here if you can't cover ground already covered by another attendee any pre preparation goes out the window and may severely limit any evidence you can present

Real issue with you, how can I have an issue with you when I don't know you from steptoe?
what I do have is my own opinion (as you & others also have) & from what I see there does seem to be some Electrical Trainee (that normaly rolls into DI) baiting/bashing, for the woes & downfalls with in the trade & a minority here soon jump on the bashing bandwagon.
Yes some of their work is way below expected standards, but the same can be said of some time served individuals & larger contractors for example, a few months ago I replaced a db in a fire station due to a burnout/loose neutral on the main switch that was less than a year old, installed on a refurb by an Approved contractor.
The casing flared & scorched/sooted the wall, not a Electrical Trainee or DI in sight, but it was an electrical fire in a cu.
Because its not a domestic job done by a Electrical Trainee I suppose it doesn't count in the five fold increase headlines?

I have seen it before where big companies use 3rd and 4th year apprentices or experienced labourers to do work or are dishing out work on a so many jobs a day to make a living wage basis. There will come a point where some Electrical Trainee's get a foothold in the commercial and industrial market it could well have already happened where employers are looking for cost savings as these guy's are looking for experience and are prepared to work for less to get it

Meaning I watched it & had my own thoughts about it & what was said.

How about......

If you have issues with Electrical Trainee & the like why not start shouting about the root cause, such as the training offered by some of these training companies that they then purposely aim at those who think 5 weeks is enough to become an electrician & yes that includes the likes of the NICEIC & some forum sponsors that can be found on electrical forums.

Then (and this is one of the tings I took out of the select meeting) how about asking why is the whole part P fiasco not being policed/enforced, yet use a logo when not entitled to you'll get hung drawn & quartered! That was hardly mentioned by the trade side of the room in the meeting.

If you have problems with the select committee and one of those giving evidence then you need to look at what followed that meeting which was well documented / reported on this forum the scams did their self protection thing, why did Ms Clancy invite Mr Skelton to meet her, why did the scams feel the need to lobby the minister directly and IMO undermine the select committee, you need to look at the bigger picture and not only a meeting lasting a few hours that from what I can see was nullified by Ms Clancy's later tactics

 

[tooleystreet]

Tactics? Oh dear??

 

[robwgun]

We was told at work these statistics have influenced the forthcoming amendment to the regs in January, we have been bought torque screwdrivers so we can tighten our terminations correctly........will see how many people actually use the torque screwdrivers!

 

[davesparks]

Will you be using your torque drivers for every connection? I mean every socket, switch or other terminal?

I am all in favour of progress and improving safety or using new tools and methods. But I think it's a poor showing if an electrician can't tighten a terminal for copper cables without the aid of torque drivers, especially the little terminals in a domestic CU.

 

[Englishman]

Will you be using your torque drivers for every connection? I mean every socket, switch or other terminal?

I am all in favour of progress and improving safety or using new tools and methods. But I think it's a poor showing if an electrician can't tighten a terminal for copper cables without the aid of torque drivers, especially the little terminals in a domestic CU.

Would imagine that the issue that is warranting their introduction has as much to do with over tightening them as under tightening them.

 

[robwgun]

I've started using the Wiha screwdriver, nice bit of kit.....we mainly use Crabtree so all mcbs are the same 1.7nm torque, and main switches are 2.3nm, so not to bad to remember....

Time will tell if it will make a difference!

 

[davesparks]

Would imagine that the issue that is warranting their introduction has as much to do with over tightening them as under tightening them.

Whether it's too tight or not tight enough it's still a poor showing for an electrician. Tightening terminals is a basic skill in this trade and if you can't master that then??????

 

[shanky887614]

im not buying into torque drivers, I dont see the point.

anyone that has been doing it a while can tell if the connection is poor by how far its turned etc.

ive got an mcb driver though so I know my connections are tight

 

[Plonker 3]

Tightening screws and double checking they are tight is obviously not part of the Electrical Trainee course hence the mass introduction of torque drivers,

 

[davesparks]

They've got no hope of learning how to use a torque driver properly then!

 

[shanky887614]

Tightening screws and double checking they are tight is obviously not part of the Electrical Trainee course hence the mass introduction of torque drivers,

will do f all on jobs like this though

I didnt even get a driver out to remove the burnt cable.

they made no effort to tighten it

 

[Plonker 3]

They've got no hope of learning how to use a torque driver properly then!

That at doesn't matter though, it will sit pretty in their tool box so when Mr Scam comes to do the annual assessment they will get bonus points for owning one.

 

[davesparks]

The same as their regs book which will still be in its cellophane wrapping

 

[robwgun]

I don't think you can go wrong with the good old fashion tug test.....