Food for Thought

[Spazz]

Yes another EICR question about landlords

Everyone knows about my fight to get RCDs and EICRs monitory.

But here is a question to see if it is already a legal requirement for EICRs!

I know there is no law stating that EICRs must be carried out but there is a law stating the electrical installation must be maintained and in safe working order.

So my question is how do you maintain and ensure that an electrical installation complies with this legal requirement without inspecting it since it was put into operation in the first place?
How do you know that it is still safe and maintained to the standard which is expected?

 

[trev]

Nicholas, I've seen it a million times where people are quite happy to make up test results "Because they know it's going to be ok" and I abhor it but a peice of paper will never change it, it's in the regs that an installation will be inspected and tested to ensure it is safe to be energised.
You think your crusade will change that? Sorry mate you're fooling yourself.
Cowboys will continue to be cowboys no matter what legislation you put in place.
Answer this one, it's a yes or no question, has part p worked as it was intended to?

 

[Spazz]

I wish I was Tony! i would be rich if I was!

I promise you now you will make more money out of this than I would!

For those who know me I used to work for St John for 6 years (volunteer) and contracted to the welsh ambulance service (in Cardiff/RCT and New Port) for 1 of those (Paid work)!
I also set up a first responder unit again voluntarily!
When i was contracted to Welsh Ambulance I did 10am-6pm then on call with first responders 6pm - 10am (next day) not paid!


I bust my back in Nov 2007 so finished with St John, Welsh Ambulance and first responder then.

i then set up a training company in Jan 2008 training care homes manual handling (most of the time for free)

I then closed that in Dec 2011 and set up the electrical in Jan 2012

I been qualified since 2003 and doing my grandfathers 15 properties (for free) when tenants move out - rewire/PIR - notifying through LABC

Now saying Im in it for the money - don't think so!

 

[Spazz]

Like I keep saying - Part P is not the problem - The problem is that people can do their own electrical work - thats not Part P - Thats that bloody European Law I can never remember the name of.

Part P has to have the sign off with LABC to comply with that Law


If I could I would try and change that European Law but I wont have a chance in hell! 27 counties obay it and it works in most of them as they are 3rd world countries.


If we didn't join the EU then and only then would there be a chance of changing the fact of joe blogs doing electrical work for mrs tight-arse

 

[trev]

Like I keep saying - Part P is not the problem - The problem is that people can do their own electrical work

People can do their own bloody gas work mate. There is nothing to stop them. My 18 year old daughter could advertise herself as a builder tomorrow if she wanted to, nothing to stop her.

 

[Spazz]

Exactly and this is the problem trev - untrained and unskilled people can install dangerous equipment!

Your 18 year old daughter could probably do a better job than some of these cow boys out there!

 

[trev]

So, ok mate you tell me what the answer is. How do we stop the sheds selling cable, CUs, MCBs, CH boilers, pipes, bricks, plaster, timber, paint?
How do you stop a wholesaler selling a socket face to a DIYer? Or a light switch?
There's nothing to stop this happening and there never will be. You're pee'ing in the wind. Sorry to put it so bluntly but that's just the way it is

 

[Spazz]

Exactly Trev

 

[trev]

Hang on mate, you're supposed to have thought all this out. After all it's your crusade.
I support a lot of what you're trying to achieve it's just that I don't think it's workable

 

[spark 68]

Nicholas,

I admire your tenacity and drive, and I actually believe you are not in it for the money.

Things I think, will stay largely unchanged for many reasons, some of which we have touched on in the three threads, not least because of vested interests, and partly, sad though it is for me to say it, is not enough people have died yet.

Part P only came about because one of the powers that be, had a family member killed due to an 'electrical incident' or mis-hap, so maybe I should re-phrase the above statement to " not enough of the right sort of people have died yet" in the circumstances you refer to.

 

[Spazz]

The things that I am tying to do dont forget is RCDs and EICRs

Its not costing me anything at all to do this!

If it goes ahead then fantastic - if it dont then as long as it raises an awareness then great!

Nothing lost either way

 

[trev]

Nicholas, I'll make a deal with you. Focus your energy on reforming Part P into a meaningful, enforceable, workable peice of legislation and I will get right behind you and help in any way I can. Many others on here would do the same I'll bet.
Maybe then you could get your present crusade to work by being inside the tent pee'ing out rather than outside it pee'ing in

 

[Spazz]

I do agree spark - I agree 100%

At the end of the day I am in this to raise an awareness and if i change 1 landlords mind then I have achieved what I set out to do!

If I get parliament on board that is gold in the Olympics! Like you said not enough of the right people have died! but find the one person who has been touched by this and could of had their child/family member saved by a RCD and they wont stop till law has changed!

i know finding that 1 person is like finding a needle in 1000 haystacks (without a metal detector)!

Like I said if I change 1 mind then I have won Bronze!

 

[Spazz]

Nicholas, I'll make a deal with you. Focus your energy on reforming Part P into a meaningful, enforceable, workable peice of legislation and I will get right behind you and help in any way I can. Many others on here would do the same I'll bet.
Maybe then you could get your present crusade to work by being inside the tent pee'ing out rather than outside it pee'ing in

You say this - but what is meaningful? what would you class as a win on this?

 

[Knobhead]

I’ll hold my hand up, I voted for the UK to join the EU in 76 or 77 I can’t remember. I just wish I could retract that vote.

But it gave the idiots the chance to stick their oar in to what was clear water. Now with BS7671 V2 the idiots have come in to full bloom!

Part “P” has added to their woeful defences with shear incompetence on the part the government.

Incompetent five week wonders now hide behind pieces of paper.

I’ve served 40 years in heavy industry, but Yan the Electrical Trainee wonder has a C&GXXX.
He’s better than me!!!!!!

Thank f*** I’m out of it now

 

[trev]

You say this - but what is meaningful? what would you class as a win on this?

1) The idea by implication that electricity used in commercial or industrial scenarios is less dangerous than that used in domestic situations.
2) Allowing any qualified electrician to work on any electrical installation. EG the likes of Tony routinely work on things that I would not even dream of looking at but cannot legally install a new lighting system in the bathroom of their own home.
3) The idiotic notion that someone who has a miniscule qualification is somehow able to carry out works that he/she has read about
Need I go on? I will if you want me to