German Market Lorry Incident

[Barry White]

The terrorist war has been smouldering forever. under the guise of the quran. They were at war with each other.
We should have left them alone to war amongst themselves. But now its all about money and oil.
Isis too are after money oil and power using the quran as a smoke screen.
So in my opinion a swarm of angry wasps around a hive has had a brick thrown at them. Everyone knows you can't help angry wasps you leave them be and they will eventually calm. The west thought it could and how wrong they were.
Saddam was portrayed to the world as the west wanted us to see him. I don't think he was a good man but was the right man to keep the country from simmering over. He definitely did a better job than we are now.
I don't know the way forward if I did I would say.

 

[Andy78]

So would you say it and it's content has nothing to do with it Marvo? Would you agree with Darkwood that the West brought this on themselves?

I'm not meaning to be antagonistic, just interested as it had not been mentioned in the thread until that point.

I would say interpretation of its content and the dwelling on certain aspects of its content is more to blame than the content itself. There is horrific war mongering murderous content in the bible too that is largely ignored.
The Quran is full of contradictions as is the bible. They both have wisdom, they both have nonsense, they both have parts that can be exploited to justify terrible things.
I don't draw any distinction between a Muslim hate preacher telling a group of people that infidels must be murdered, and GW Bush telling his nation that God told him to invade Iraq. The only similarity being that only morons woulds buy into either argument.

Awful people exploit religious texts in their pursuit of being awful, much the same as people exploit rules and laws to their own gain.

 

[Pete999]

A

I would say interpretation of its content and the dwelling on certain aspects of its content is more to blame than the content itself. There is horrific war mongering murderous content in the bible too that is largely ignored.
The Quran is full of contradictions as is the bible. They both have wisdom, they both have nonsense, they both have parts that can be exploited to justify terrible things.
I don't draw any distinction between a Muslim hate preacher telling a group of people that infidels must be murdered, and GW Bush telling his nation that God told him to invade Iraq. The only similarity being that only morons woulds buy into either argument.

Awful people exploit religious texts in their pursuit of being awful, much the same as people exploit rules and laws to their own gain.

Andy, how right you are,

 

[Barry White]

So would you say it and it's content has nothing to do with it Marvo? Would you agree with Darkwood that the West brought this on themselves?

I'm not meaning to be antagonistic, just interested as it had not been mentioned in the thread until that point.

As most agree the bible and the quran have passages in them that were for different times or people or have been interpreted wrong.
Have a look at the Christian ways of the past how civilised we were then.Crusades - Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

Religion is used by the powerfull to control the masses. In the modern world they use tv and media to brainwash us.

 

[Andy78]

Just to clarify my last point and better answer Eion's post.

There are hundreds of millions of people that manage to extract and accept useful, wise, peaceful teachings from both the Quran and the Bible, amongst other religious texts.
The people that seek to exploit the worst parts of religion are always the few, and one cannot attribute this exploitation to any group of people, either ethnically or otherwise, as a generalisation.

 

[Darkwood]

As has just been pointed out, most religious scripture regardless of what religion we look at has some form of encouragement to hate or harm others just because of their beliefs or sexuality so you cannot point the finger solely at the qur'an and it's content, there has to be other underlying driving forces and when it comes to Islam this tends to be a internal argument of the interpretation of what the qur'an actually means hence the massive divides that has been happening for thousands of years between shia and sunny Muslims... now I'm no expert here but when you step into a thousand year war of ideology with a few billion Muslims then regardless where in the world they live and regardless of them not directly effected by the invasion of Iraq or Syria for that matter, they see you as the enemy as you have declared holy war on their way of interpreting Islam hence many terrorists are home grown ... the issues with Islam and it's followers has always existed .. where we messed up was by taking sides in our foreign policy actions. This in my mind is Bush and Blairs legacy which has invited terror to the west a crime I believe they should both be answering for.

 

[Diddy]

It all went downhill after the people's judean front split and formed the peoples front of judea......bloody splitters !!!

 

[Diddy]

For the more serious points raised I also agree with Darkwood. We did bring this on ourselves. Well our leaders did on our behalf most probably assisted by a whole bunch of different agencies with different vested interest.
I really don't think we can deny what our involvement direct or otherwise has done and continues to do each and every day. We installed Saddam when he was our friend lol. we assisted him in taking power. We "trained" Osama Bin Laden and HIS crew to further our "interests" in the middle east. We assisted those who tried to overthrow Assad.....shame they turned to ISIS when "liberated". We also assisted the arab spring uprising in various other countries.....Willing the toppling of Gadaffi.....not long after we were meeting the man in his tent and doing deals with him....
I always think of how I would feel in their situation if I was say a spark who lived and worked in say Baghdad or Tripoli ect....I mean these places had harsh regimes but had electricity, running water, healthcare, education ect ect ect, Im not so sure I would be overly impressed by the west's "help".
There is a huge case in all of the above to answer the charge of "You broke it so YOU fix it". Maybe WE are far too easy on our own leaders as ultimately it will be us who pay the price in blood and treasure to right any wrongs.

 

[Barry White]

Seems they have found the man they were looking for. He was shot dead see Berlin attack suspect shot dead in Italy - http://news.sky.com/story/berlin-attack-suspect-shot-dead-in-italy-minister-confirms-10705730

more here including a video pledge to isis

Berlin attacker filmed video pledge to IS - http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/berlin-attacker-filmed-video-pledge-to-is/ar-BBxuCpk?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=iehp

 

[Octopus]

They could only identify him because of his German ID card!

 

[Barry White]

Says they identified him by his fingerprints?

 

[Octopus]

Says they identified him by his fingerprints?

In Germany when you "register" when you arrive, they take your photo and finger prints .... the UK should do the same

 

[andyb]

In Germany when you "register" when you arrive, they take your photo and finger prints .... the UK should do the same

We do Murdoch, and the finger print is put onto an international data base to see if they've applied for assylem elswhere.

 

[Octopus]

We do Murdoch, and the finger print is put onto an international data base to see if they've applied for assylem elswhere.

That's news to me...... Role out id cards for all

 

[andyb]

That's news to me...... Role out id cards for all

Not for me, I'll not be carrying one.