Getting across ceiling joists from below - tricks of the trade.

[FatAlan]

In the day and age of ..how many downlights can we get into one house, I'm intrigued to know what tricks / techniques folks use to install multiple downlights into an existing ceiling in replacement of a central pendant. In particular, once having located the joists, how do you get the cables across or through the joists with minimal damage to the ceiling? Is it a case of just cutting an access hole in the ceiling across the bottom of the joist so that you can see both sides with enough space to drill a hole (building regs compliant). Does anyone cut small notches and protect with steel plates for instance?

 

[suffolkspark]

I've had coving down before to run along when the joists direction isn't in my favour then just drilled a hole back up to get into the spaces I need

 

[Welchyboy1]

Drill 100mm holes between joists, with a sharp hole cutter, about 3inches from one side of the joist, if you can

Use a 400mm long wood spade bit to drill through joists at appropriate height (ALWAYS check the other side of the joist before you drill through for pipes and cables)

Cut up 8in lengths of 1x2in roof batten(keep an eye out in builders skips they usually discard loads of off cuts), or the bits that come in oven packaging!
keep it in your van always

Use drywall screws to fix batten across holes and fix your circular cut out back in hole after wiring(paying attention to which way round they go and what one went it what hole, this is important for the best making good job)

Buy a bag of easi-fill and get some decent making good tools and fill holes
I personally use a little squirty water bottle to wet the area first and prevents your filler from drying out, but generally even a child can make a good job with this stuff its excellent!

Job done!

 

[Welchyboy1]

Drill 100mm holes between joists, with a sharp hole cutter, about 3inches from one side of the joist, if you can

Use a 400mm long wood spade bit to drill through joists at appropriate height (ALWAYS check the other side of the joist before you drill through for pipes and cables)

Cut up 8in lengths of 1x2in roof batten(keep an eye out in builders skips they usually discard loads of off cuts), or the bits that come in oven packaging!
keep it in your van always

Use drywall screws to fix batten across holes and fix your circular cut out back in hole after wiring(paying attention to which way round they go and what one went it what hole, this is important for the best making good job)

Buy a bag of easi-fill and get some decent making good tools and fill holes
I personally use a little squirty water bottle to wet the area first and prevents your filler from drying out, but generally even a child can make a good job with this stuff its excellent!

Job done!

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Lost count of number of customers in new builds who in the rush to move in decide to lay expensive carpet and decorate. Then call a electrician to fit downlights if only they waited a week or so.
The one that annoys me is when you feed a cable between two parallel joists and find theres a timber going between them!
I am a fan of the hole being made.good with a timber and use the disc method.
Did just that last week in a new apartment, the ceiling and walls are all metal stud work so easy to find but due to amount of insulation and the sprinkler system being in the gap, had to cut holes to move lights.
Customer will be getting it sorted by decorators afterwords.

 

[FatAlan]

Drill 100mm holes between joists, with a sharp hole cutter, about 3inches from one side of the joist, if you can

Use a 400mm long wood spade bit to drill through joists at appropriate height (ALWAYS check the other side of the joist before you drill through for pipes and cables)

Cut up 8in lengths of 1x2in roof batten(keep an eye out in builders skips they usually discard loads of off cuts), or the bits that come in oven packaging!
keep it in your van always

Use drywall screws to fix batten across holes and fix your circular cut out back in hole after wiring(paying attention to which way round they go and what one went it what hole, this is important for the best making good job)

Buy a bag of easi-fill and get some decent making good tools and fill holes
I personally use a little squirty water bottle to wet the area first and prevents your filler from drying out, but generally even a child can make a good job with this stuff its excellent!

Job done!

Good tips there. If you are drilling from one side of the joist through a 100mm hole how can you check to see if there’s anything on the other side without check via an access hole? Is that what you mean by 100mm holes between all joists that you’re routing between?

 

[Rpa07]

Yes you’ll be needing to get the cable on the other side of that joist so you’ll either have a downlight size hole to check what’s on other side of joist or another 100mm to carry on the run.
It’s a thinker of a job at the best of times but doesn’t really matter if you cut a few wrong distanced holes at this stage!

 

[Wilko]

Good tips there. If you are drilling from one side of the joist through a 100mm hole how can you check to see if there’s anything on the other side without check via an access hole? Is that what you mean by 100mm holes between all joists that you’re routing between?

Proper 18 hole golf course sometimes ... hopefully half get filled by lights .

 

[DefyG]

Drill the holes for the downlights and use those holes as much as possible for feeding cables through.
If I cant see any existing cable runs through the new holes, I make an educated guess where existing cable runs might be through the joists (ie approx. 0.25 span of the joists and then drill further access holes (perhaps larger than the lights if necessary) and use existing cable runs rather than drill new holes - not always possible though.

Supporting cables is another issue though!!

 

[Zerax]

Lost count of number of customers in new builds who in the rush to move in decide to lay expensive carpet and decorate. Then call a electrician to fit downlights if only they waited a week or so....

I was working in a similar one the other week... the owner has spent the best part of £25k for new kitchen, laminate flooring, walls all skimmed and redecorated everywhere... now she's decided she wants extra power sockets and tv/ethernet cables installed !

 

[Leesparkykent]

by the time you’ve piddled around making holes, repairing holes, filling, sanding, painting etc it would be quicker and a superior finish to cut a length of the existing board out, opposite to the way the joists are running, run cables in and overboard the whole ceiling and tape and joint it.

 

[stevels4]

Artex is horrible to repair

I just done a small job a kitchen where the electrical job took about 25 mins after cutting a small hatch in the ceiling

The making good and applying a fresh splodge of artex to the new bit of boardi put in took about 3.5 hours in an attempt to make it look like the ceiling hadn’t been cut

Artex.......ASBESTOS Reinforced Texturing...happy cutting!

 

[Midwest]

by the time you’ve piddled around making holes, repairing holes, filling, sanding, painting etc it would be quicker and a superior finish to cut a length of the existing board out, opposite to the way the joists are running, run cables in and overboard the whole ceiling and tape and joint it.

I've already said that, cuff.

 

[johnduffell]

I'm intrigued to know what tricks / techniques folks use to install multiple downlights into an existing ceiling in replacement of a central pendant.

I find surface trunking is the quuickest, complies with all the regs as well if you use suitable metal bands around the cables, job done.

 

[Midwest]

Wot between each down light

 

[mark641]

Artex is horrible to repair [cut]

I dont agree. Artex is just horrible.