Help me make sense of the quals'!

[TankFlyBoss]

Hi all,

I currently hold the 3-year installation NVQ (C&G 2365) as well as the latest 17th Edition certificate, beyond that nothing else. I do not practice domestic electrical work, however I do work in industry.

Now, my parents' house is in need of some work, having been quite shocked recently having done an unofficial test of the wiring, namely it requires the ancient Wylex fuseboard replacing (two fuses for a three bedroom house no less, one lighting, one ring!) as well as the electric cooker putting on to a new circuit and taken off of a plug-top (thanks MFI circa 1995!)

The cooker one was bizarre, there WAS a proper cooker spur from the fuseboard to the kitchen, however when MFI refitted the kitchen in the mid-90's they cut this spur out, and put a 13A front on then wired it in to the ring?!

Now, I can't make head-nor-tale of the regulations, if I took a quick Part-P course and registered would this allow me to carry out this work? I don't want to practice domestic electrics really, and my job doesn't really involve it that much however it is a reasonable cost I may do it just so that I can legitimately do jobs for friends and relatives etc.

So let's imagine today I took a Part-P course, what next, does that allow me to sign-off work under Part-P or do I require further qualifications? I can't seem to get a clear answer from anybody, and that included my college tutors (who generally sucked their teeth and said 'we don't understand what this 2365 is about either...)

It seems daft to waste three-years attending college, might as well get some benefit from it!

Any answers or suggestions welcome.


TFB.

 

[Wilko]

Welcome to the forum TFB.
For the work you are thinking about the local council building control will need to be notified and then approve (Part P of building regs). They do this for a fee, same idea as any other building permit. To streamline this for all, the Competent Person Scheme was created. If you are in one, then LBC accepts your Scheme's notice of the work. It's a bit of cost and work to join a Scheme and probably not worth it for just one job.
If you want the joy of doing the work yourself, perhaps chat to your local friendly spark and see if you can work for them on the job. It may lead onto other things. Hope that helps

 

[TankFlyBoss]

Welcome to the forum TFB.
For the work you are thinking about the local council building control will need to be notified and then approve (Part P of building regs). They do this for a fee, same idea as any other building permit. To streamline this for all, the Competent Person Scheme was created. If you are in one, then LBC accepts your Scheme's notice of the work. It's a bit of cost and work to join a Scheme and probably not worth it for just one job.
If you want the joy of doing the work yourself, perhaps chat to your local friendly spark and see if you can work for them on the job. It may lead onto other things. Hope that helps

Cheers for the helpful reply Wilko!

As said it's just for one job really, unfortunately I don't know any friendly sparks near my parents' home (we live quite some distance apart) so there isn't anybody I know I could sweet-talk to come and assist.

If I carried out the work and advised local building control (as well as pay the requisite fee) would that cover me? I'm quite happy to have my work inspected, I just don't want to get in to any hot-water over doing work. I'm happy to change the odd socket-face or lamp fitting for a friend, however when it comes to DB's etc I'm far more cautious.

It's irritating that I was signed on to a three-year day release to get my 2365 to then be told half-way through it doesn't give any grading, yet if we wanted to add the five-day Part-P (along with any other randomer off the street) we could go forward for domestic installation. As this was employer funded there was no benefit to them to enter us on the apprenticeship, doubly so as we only practice in the heavy industry environment.

I have looked at Part-P & registration, however I'd need to set up a business which instantly makes it not particularly cost effective but I also understand why the rules need to be in place.

I guess another option would to just be to carry out the work safely and competently to 17th Edition then erm.... Just not tell anybody?

Cheers,
TFB.

 

[The Ghost]

You say the wylex board needs replacing, however in the ElectricalSafetyFirst.org best practice guide this is indicated as not necessary. Unless the tests you did show some egregious problem? It is unusual to find just a two way wylex board. You might want to pan back a little maybe and consider the necessity no?

 

[Midwest]

TFB, another option, if you think you have suitable skills, knowledge, test equipment is to do the work yourself. As Wilko said, it would require notification to LBC. You could contact your LBC before starting work, and convince them you are suitably qualified; I read here before, other electricians, who are not in a scheme have done just that.

A member has posted before, a link to a web site, which some LBC's use to check C&G (etc) qualifications.

Alternatively you could use a third party inspector, operated by Napit & Stroma. Lastly, you could do the work, again inform your LBC before starting, who would then have your work inspected & tested as it progressed, for a fee!

I wouldn't go down the route of doing the work and not inform LBC, there have been a number of threads recently, where people have done this, and then had a problem when its been spotted by an eagle eyed solicitor, when conveyancing the property for sale.

 

[uksrevivor]

Some LBC's are quite accommodating as I found with mine I had to send in a building control notice stating the exact work that will be carried out then along with that copies of all my certifications and a copy of my multifunction tester calibration certificate. I contacted them on completion of the consumer board change and sent the test certification paperwork with it. They accepted this as proof of competence and sent a completion notification to the homeowner and myself.
Total cost for building notice £115 expensive I know but fully compliant.
My advice is contact them and comply with the building regs as it may cause major problems and a lot of expense if they ever want to sell the house in the future.

 

[Des 56]

I guess another option would to just be to carry out the work safely and competently to 17th Edition then erm.... Just not tell anybody? Naughty

I have a lot of sympathy for yours and all other sparks working in different sectors who may have to put up with the bureaucratic and expensive procedure that is inflicted on electricians
If they want regulation of the electrician it should be via a national non profit making registration of suitably trained installers (It could even be called something like "JIB registration")


The situation suggested of having a solicitor trawling the council bins and coming up with no Part P notification is usually remedied by having a Eicr submitted by a competent person
In the event of a requirement for a Eicr you may find a competent person looking back at you in your special location mirror

 

[Toneyz]

I guess another option would to just be to carry out the work safely and competently to 17th Edition then erm.... Just not tell anybody? Naughty

I have a lot of sympathy for yours and all other sparks working in different sectors who may have to put up with the bureaucratic and expensive procedure that is inflicted on electricians
If they want regulation of the electrician it should be via a national non profit making registration of suitably trained installers (It could even be called something like "JIB registration")


The situation suggested of having a solicitor trawling the council bins and coming up with no Part P notification is usually remedied by having a Eicr submitted by a competent person
In the event of a requirement for a Eicr you may find a competent person looking back at you in your special location mirror

A good example of this was one of the NICEIC area engineers we had was extending his house and had to go down the 3rd party route /LABC route as I have said before on here a opportunity was lost of not going down the same as gas safe has tied in with the CSCS/ECS card. I bet there is a lot of electricians on here that do as I do commercial work eg schools etc that in theory can't just run a supply for a shower in their own homes.