Help with certifying

[JUD]

To certify notifiable work you need to be recognised as competent by either being part of a competent person scheme such as napit, elecsa , the other one or some really unknown ones
OR
be recognised as competent by the local authority building control concerned.

Have a look at THIS SITE

 

[pushrod]

Have a look at THIS SITE

Mmmmhh this always gets me going

"A Competent Person must be registered with a scheme that has been approved by The Department for Communities and Local Government (DCLG). Schemes authorised by the DCLG are listed on its website at
This website has been developed by a collaboration of all of the approved scheme providers (and their wordsmiths) to provide the consumer with the ability to search for a Competent Person registered with one of the schemes."

To my mind a competent person is not a "Competent Person" - they (the scheme providers) have defined the latter as being someone who is a member of one of their schemes, but a competent person is just that, somebody who has sufficient skill, knowledge and experience to do the job.

Certainly there are many local authorities who recognise people as competent to carry out electrical work even though they are not members of "schemes".

It is also in the interest of the "schemes" to create the illusion (by funding websites like the above) that you can only be competent or should i say "Competent" if you are paying them £400+ of your hard earned.

[Please note that at no time time did i accidentally say scam instead of scheme ]

 

[JUD]

Certainly there are many local authorities who recognise people as competent to carry out electrical work even though they are not members of "schemes".

My question is does this make any difference with regards to LABC fees and the notification process?

 

[pushrod]

"Q10: Will electrical contractors be forced to join a Competent Person Scheme?


There are three routes for those carrying out 'notifiable' electrical installation work in dwellings to demonstrate that they have complied with the requirements.

1. To join a competent person self-certification scheme, which is recommended for those who regularly undertake notifiable work in domestic premises.
2. Competent persons who only infrequently carry out work in domestic premises need not register with a competent persons self-certification scheme. However if they are not registered they must notify building control before carrying out the work and should meet all of the requirements of BS 7671 regarding design, installation, inspection and testing, and certification.
3. DIY electrical work is not to be encouraged, however where a householder wishes to carry out electrical work they must notify building control before commencing work. Building control will arrange for the work to be, inspected and tested at various stages and will charge a fee to cover any costs incurred.

There is no requirement to join a scheme. It will be perfectly acceptable to submit building notices to the local authority. It will be a matter for each individual electrical contracting firm to decide which of the above two routes to compliance would be best for their business."

The above is taken from HERE at the IET (JUD note how the word competent is used purely as an adjective and not as part of a proper noun as in the scheme's information/advertising web link that you posted)

There are three ways to legally carry out work. Note the diferences between 2. and 3. The second one is for competent persons rather than DIYers and there is no mention of fees for the inspection and testing of work. The onus, however, will be on the person to prove competency to the LABC and i would think that could be done by showing qualifications. I suspect as well that there maybe a little bit of a battle with some "lazy LABCs" to be recognised as competent, as the schemes are doing such a good job at making people think there is only one way to legally do domestic electrical work!!!

and now i shall relax and think happy thoughts

 

[Des 56]

Just to try and confuse the issue even more (if that is possible with this utter trash concept,part p0

I dont think a competent person is a person at all
Its a buisness

 

[JUD]

Just to try and confuse the issue even more (if that is possible with this utter trash concept,part p0

I dont think a competent person is a person at all
Its a buisness

Ahhh but a "sole trader" is a business and a person rolleyes: or is it someone who sells shoes)

@pushrod. If you are right about LABC, why is everyone running around giving their hard earned £££ to the schemes?

It must just be to get the fancy stickers for their vans.

 

[pushrod]

Ahhh but a "sole trader" is a business and a person rolleyes: or is it someone who sells shoes)

@pushrod. If you are right about LABC, why is everyone running around giving their hard earned £££ to the schemes?

It must just be to get the fancy stickers for their vans.

Nah... a sole trader is a fishmonger


There are advantages to belonging to a scheme

1) You do not have to deal with lots of different authorities if you work over a wide area

2) You do not need to notify in advance

3) You have a helpline available to you

4) You have advertising and the chance to put a logo on your paperwork and a sticker on your van.

However if you don't mind doing without the above and you are qualified enough to prove your competency there should be no need to join a scheme.

 

[pushrod]

Just to try and confuse the issue even more (if that is possible with this utter trash concept,part p0

I dont think a competent person is a person at all
Its a buisness

Yep Des and if it is a business that involves more than one person is there any guarantee for the customer that they are getting the organ grinder and not the monkey ?

 

[Mr.Black]

So can or can't you use the 3 part cert then? Can anyone prove what is the legal standing on this issue.

I'm being asked all the time to "cert" a job that other sparks have done but don't have their part P.
Should i just do a periodic report???

I've been turning down much needed income.

Can any of the moderators help out here please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[andyb]

So can or can't you use the 3 part cert then? Can anyone prove what is the legal standing on this issue.

I'm being asked all the time to "cert" a job that other sparks have done but don't have their part P.
Should i just do a periodic report???

I've been turning down much needed income.

Can any of the moderators help out here please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just do a PIR.

You are not doing this for the labc, you are doing it for the homeowner because the homeowner asked you to.
What they then do with this is up to them. There is no need to turn down work.

The problem with using a 3 signature eic is that you are doing this to knowingly by pass the law, why would you do this?

 

[JUD]

So can or can't you use the 3 part cert then? Can anyone prove what is the legal standing on this issue.

I'm being asked all the time to "cert" a job that other sparks have done but don't have their part P.
Should i just do a periodic report???

I've been turning down much needed income.

Can any of the moderators help out here please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just do a PIR.

You are not doing this for the labc, you are doing it for the homeowner because the homeowner asked you to.
What they then do with this is up to them. There is no need to turn down work.

The problem with using a 3 signature eic is that you are doing this to knowingly by pass the law, why would you do this?

When I suggested the 3 part EIC in post #6 I asked if the job had been notified to LABC.

If so, I don't see how using a 3 part EIC would be bypassing any laws, it's a standard IEE document.

I also said in post #9 that I didn't think you would be able to do this under a scheme provider.

In any case somebody has to notify the job, weather that's through LABC or a scheme provider.

I'NT PART P BRILLIANT!!!!

 

[andyb]

In any case somebody has to notify the job, weather that's through LABC or a scheme provider.

I agree with what you say Jud, I'm just saying why bother.

Somebody does indeed have to notify the job, but not Mr Black, it's not his problem.

As I said if asked, do a pir and charge accordingly.