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Dear All,

Newbie here, not sure if this forum is for those who specifically electricians only or if general people can join for help and advice, so im taking a shot here, if this is the wrong website then please let me know and ill just copy and paste it there or wherever is appropriate

I need help as im in a dispute with someone who i hired to fit an electrical shower. Me and my family live in a housing association house who were East Homes but now are L&Q. In 2016 i started looking for a trader to help fit this shower for me, through word of mouth i came across someone who was hired by a family friend to do some painting job even though he says hes like an all rounder person. He came to view the house and where we wanted the shower and advised etc He said he would take on the job, i wasnt around home at the time due to university and my mum was when the actual works were being done, he did this around Mid 2016. He charged about ÂŁ400, no proper contract or receipt given. He also had brought in another electrician to actually certify the work and to make it go live, have a copy of this certificate also. Managed to find out this electrician was with the NIC and Napit but no longer is since 2015

The work wasnt good, the conduit pipings he fitted started to fall off from the walls and tape also, he did this around the front main door and i kept having to fix them, he made some holes which werent correct and never repaired them, he left a breaker box not screwed down properly either, contacted him to try and fix this and he said he would come round but never came, after many calls to him and no answer, i gave up and did my diy of the conduit pipes but not the breaker box.

Fast forward to late 2018, L&Q came for a random inspection and basically saw the work and complained for health and safety and complained about the holes etc and basicaly disconnected the shower, we have been out of the shower since around November of last year. The L&Q electrician came and saw this and then went to the person who i hired, to his house left him a note about his work and there was some words between the two exchanged. The person i hired came round instantly said that his work is immaculate and nothings wrong with it. We said that we he needs to fix what the landlord said and he said he would after christmas, now its 2019 and April is almost ending and still nothing.

He came around in the end of February and said that he will charge more for having the conduits fixed, L&Q said he needed to have put metal brackets which he didnt and some exposed wire and to correct the amp also. He said all this costs extra money, i said surely not because he shouldve known this. He then said to me that all this about metal brackets on conduit pipes has only come in the new regulation of 2019 and when he did the work in 2016 it didnt matter he also gave an example of Grenfell to me. He also said id have to pay another electrician to get this certified

What i need to know is this:

Is he right about the regulation for 2019 where all conduit pipes need to have brackets which are near fire exit routes?

Do i have to pay more? I mean shouldnt have offer something

Where can i go to report him and get this work done because isnt listening to me and is adamant that he will only do more work for more money

I can provide pictures of the job but im not sure if this could be the right website, if this is then let me know please and i will because its been so long to get this sorted out, im busy with university and my mums busy with hospital runs with my sister

Any advice or information will be appreciated

Thanks
 
Pics are great! Grenfell had nothing to do with introduction of fire clips, this goes way before that. & to my knowledge that fire had bugger all to do with the fixed wiring, it was the fabric & construction method of the building along with an appliance fault (allegedly).
I have a good idea but what is the "amp" issue refered to?
As far as who to complain to, the body the signing off electrician is affiliated with would be they. Given its a notifiable job the ref number & membership number should be on the certificate. Other than trading standards you will no recourse with the handyman. Even they might not take it up.
Give us more info, & pics as already said.
Pics are great! Grenfell had nothing to do with introduction of fire clips, this goes way before that. & to my knowledge that fire had bugger all to do with the fixed wiring, it was the fabric & construction method of the building along with an appliance fault (allegedly).
I have a good idea but what is the "amp" issue refered to?
As far as who to complain to, the body the signing off electrician is affiliated with would be they. Given its a notifiable job the ref number & membership number should be on the certificate. Other than trading standards you will no recourse with the handyman. Even they might not take it up.
Give us more info, & pics as already said.

Im assuming he told me about Grenfell because he said that the only reason that fire started there was because there werent any metal brackets there so thats why the new regulation has been put into place, im not sure how true that is

The "amp" is referred to because the landlord said he has apparently fitted the wrong amp? it was low in power or voltage as i recall, so that has to be addressed

Currently trying to figure a way out to post pics

Also with the certificate, i can upload that also but ive not been able to find much about who the body is for it, ive given the ref numbers to NIC and Napit and im sure one more place that begins with S, theyve not got any information on the subcontractor
 
Legally the only Contract was between you and the man who installed the shower. The electrician would be classed as a sub-contractor and so is too remote legally from you to take any action.
In the absence of any form of written Contract there would be an assumed Contract which ultimately could need a Judge to rule on the terms and the liabilities to you, and you really do not want to go there, trust me.
If you try to sue the shower man on the basis that the electrics are not safe then potentially you would have to explain and defend why you allowed a non-competent person to work on your electrical system in breach of the EAWR - and that is not going to help your case.
Probably best to ask the Housing Association to undertake any remedial work or find a professional yourself.

If i try this before a judge, would i potentially lose?

What if i was trying to sue the shower man on the basis that the quality and safety of work wasnt adequate enough?

My hosing association have said that because the job was done by shower man, he should fix this issue, they wont get involved because we didnt get it done through them but at the time, they said to us that they wouldnt carry out this job for us, instead we find someone else to do it
 
Hi,i'm afraid all bets are off,if you undertook this work without the permission from the landlord.
I would say that you probably need to employ a competent person,and get the installation to a state where the landlord is content.

It sounds from your post,that the landlord is taking a fairly relaxed attitude...this may be because they could demand the work done,is removed or made good,or even do that themselves and charge accordingly.

Not very cheerful,or helpful,i admit,but this is how i see it,at this stage.

Technically the landlord did give permission for me to get this from someone else because at the time they said they wouldnt carry this work out themselves, the only problem they have is the quality of the work and the safety of it
 
I just need any sort of help in knowing what my grounds are, my rights and if i can get him to fix his work or if his work is good and i should pay extra to get it live again

Any sort of regulations or rules i can say to him that might make him realise i know things would help please
 
Thats a lash up alright. The incorrect amps that keeps been mentioned must be the 20A DP switch instead of a 45A or 50A Isolator.

The subcontractor he used should be coming back. Report to the NIC or whatever scheme he was with.

Big advert there for why sticky trunking should be used solely to assist installation, not as a permenant fixture.
 
That is definitely a rough job!! Looking at the pictures I'd be tempted to say it all needs ripping out and starting again properly. This is why people should employ proper tradesmen who are qualified & experienced and ideally come with good recommendations.

My advice - Employ a proper spark to come and rectify it asap.

Not sure if there is any merit in taking this guy to court, you would have to seek legal advice on that. But he should be! so he thinks twice about ripping someone else off with dodgy unsafe work.
 
Technically the landlord did give permission for me to get this from someone else because at the time they said they wouldnt carry this work out themselves, the only problem they have is the quality of the work and the safety of it

Hi,"Technically" has no part in this,either your landlord gave permission,or not. To avoid you having to rectify the issue,to the landlord's satisfaction,you would need this written permission.

If the landlord has informed you that the quality and safety,is a problem,then they have accepted knowledge of this,and would have to have the installation either fixed,or removed. This will undoubtedly be in your tenancy agreement.

I am not trying to sink your boat,and i appreciate,that this work was done with the best intentions,but i think your primary task,should not be chasing the muppets who let you down, You need to be ensuring the landlord is satisfied with the situation,as their first point of call,regarding any monies due,will be you.
 
I just need any sort of help in knowing what my grounds are, my rights and if i can get him to fix his work or if his work is good and i should pay extra to get it live again

Any sort of regulations or rules i can say to him that might make him realise i know things would help please

Why do you want the same guy back to fix this? Get a proper electrician to re-do the whole lot.

Take plenty of pictures and get the proper electrician to issue a independent report. You can use this to threaten the handy man with legal action to reclaim some your money. Draw a line under this and move on having learnt your lesson.
 
Hi and good morning.
I cannot offer advice nor should you construe my comments as such. What I will do is to offer an opinion.
First over and above all I would NOT take court action. It will cost a lot of money and more than you could recover.


This is what I would do. You decide if this would be suitable for you.
1 : Obtain a survey of what needs to be done to make the installation compliant. This would be best obtained from the housing association, who I hope would be helpful to you in the circumstances. If not pay for a survey by a competent electrical contractor who should set out in writing what is required to make the work good.
2 : Write formally to your shower man and tell him that the installation has not been installed in accordance with the requirements of BS7671, and that following a safety inspection by the housing association, the shower has been disconnected by them.
Confirm that you enclose a survey report that details the remedial work that needs to be undertaken to bring the installation into compliance with BS7671.
3 : Request that he makes good the work and brings it up to a standard that complies with BS7671 and the relevant BS7671 Certificates are issued.
4 : Advise him that he is free to make good the work himself, or appoint a competent contractor to do so on his behalf, and that the total cost of the remedial works and issue of the relevant Certificates will be borne by himself. Whichever way he wishes to proceed with the work he should supply you with evidence that those who will do the work are suitably qualified and competent to do this by means of registration with a suitable trade association, and membership of a Competent Person Scheme in respect of the electrical inspection and testing work.
5 : Tell him that for the avoidance of doubt completion of the remedial works will only occur once the relevant test and inspection certificates have been made available, and the housing association landlord is satisfied with the standard of the remedial work.
6 : Request that he replies within 14 days of receipt of this letter setting out how he intends to proceed, and that if he does not reply within that you reserve the right to instruct a Contractor to undertake the remedial work, and will expect him to reimburse you the full costs of this.


Keep a copy of this letter, and the attachments, which if you have them should include any evidence from the housing association as to the condition/disconnection of the supply, and the survey report that sets out the work required to make the installation compliant. Do NOT discuss money at this stage.


Send the letter recorded delivery, and keep the receipt. You should also state at the start of the letter that it has been sent by recorded delivery to confirm receipt.

Wait for 21 days before moving to the next stage.
 
Last edited:
Back to basics on this whole post. Lesson learnt I'm afraid to say. Get a qualified spark in and demand to see his qualifications etc if you're not sure. Let the spark decide what can be saved and what needs removing. Get him to certify it (not someone else). Then let others know about the "handy man" and not to use him for electrical work. The guy that signed his work off and certified it needs to be mentioned as well as he has no right to self certify due to him not being a member of any scheme. I would think the NIC or Nappit or whoever would not take lightly to someone using their certificates when they are no longer a member. They would probably pursue him for you and give him a good rogering!
 
Why would you get a painter to install your electric shower?

Bludi sure I wouldn't get a spark to paint my living room!

Oh...no...wait a minute...

Sparks can paint! No-one's going to die if they use the wrong stuff...doh!
An old saying I will always remember "If you can p--- you can paint"
 

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