immersion heater and a shower pump

[tonys]

An immersion heater on a plug top - not allowed as should be on a switched connection unit to BS 1363-4. What code would you give it ? and out of interest what is the thinking in not allowing it as a plug and socket would give double pole isolation?
cheers.

Where exactly does this information come from ?

 

[SimpleSimon]

Yeah I agree Pushrod, but I was just trying to think of their reasoning behind the ambigous regs. How many householders bother to switch off before removing plug and it's a fairly heavy load. It wouldn't take too long to burn the socket/plug if it was done regularly. I know you say that's unlikely, but expect the unexpected with the uninitiated.

The only reasoning I can think is with a plug and socket the householder than has the chance to put one of those double plug top and have both the immersion heater and some other big appliance on the same circuit. Possible overload.

But the reasoning goes out of the window because immersion spurs are usually located in an airing cupboard so what else you would fit in an airing cupboard I don't know.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

I suspect the reason is that most 13a plugs and sockets dont handle prolonged periods at maximum load very well. I've seen plenty of burnt out 13a sockets in airing cupboards....often with piles of clothes stacked round them.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Problem with putting a 3kw load onto a BS 1363 Socket is the load on the socket outlet not the circuit. Very few sockets today are designed to take a 3kw load on the socket and plug top, MK and Crabtree still might, but the majiority of them are rated at about 8-10amps,

A lot of people get the not allowed bit from appendix 15 where they mistake not supplying from the ring final circuit to mean a BS 1363 Socket. Because it is a large load if it was connected to a ring it might deem to unbalance it.

Though a BS 1363 socket outlet affords you on load isolation and functional switching the same as a BS 1363-4 FCU very few sockets are double pole as the FCU normally is, and you have the loading situation as I stated above.

IMO I would not connected a 3kw load with a plug and socket.

 

[andyb]

Where exactly does this information come from ?

554.3.3 Tony

 

[malcolmsanford]

Nice one Andy I clean forgot about that one but spot on.

 

[pushrod]

Where exactly does this information come from ?

Nice one Andy I clean forgot about that one but spot on.

I already quoted that (554.3.3) and GN1 (page 131) in post #3


Keep up at the back

 

[malcolmsanford]

I already quoted that (554.3.3) and GN1 (page 131) in post #3


Keep up at the back

Got to remember mate that age is selective, I neverl isten to a word you say push ....................

No fair do's mate you did, and I did forget about the old heaters immersed in water regs.

 

[pushrod]

Where exactly does this information come from ?

Got to remember mate that age is selective, I never listen to a word you say push ....................

No fair do's mate you did, and I did forget about the old heaters immersed in water regs.

Well that is you, the wife and quite a few others ....... LOL

 

[terminator]

I already quoted that (554.3.3) and GN1 (page 131) in post #3


Keep up at the back

Yes you did quote that and I missed that as well - well done pushrod. It was 1.00 in the morning (well that's my excuse)

 

[amychats]

Can't see how a timer is going to help you really. Even if you fit it and it comes on in line with your storage heaters, the circuit to the immersion heater is still going to be on connected to your normal tariff.


thanks for your help.isnt all my electric cheaper during e7 hours anyway?or just the storage heaters?

 

[tonys]

I already quoted that (554.3.3) and GN1 (page 131) in post #3


Keep up at the back

Under the 16th I was pulled by the NICEIC for coding a "plug top immersion domestic one" wanted to know whether it was different under the 17th so I need to look a bit closer into this one for the future.

Cheers Tony

 

[tonys]

Just looked a bit deeper into this, and domestic type immersion heaters are of an insulated type not an uninsulated type.

Therefore Regulation 554.3.3 does not apply to the type I'm referring too, the ones that are fitted into cylinders in domestic situations.

That's why the NICEIC put me in my place a about 4 years ago when I was carrying out PIR's under the 16th Edition and nothing as changed in the 17th Edition to my knowledge.

So a plug top is acceptable.

Cheers Tony

 

[Martin Bradley]

Hi im new to this site, you are correct the Imm Heater should not be on a plug top nor should it be on a 13 amp double pole fused spur, it should be on a 20 amp doulbe pole unfused spure, the reason being is that under current regs the 13 amp double pole fused spure falls below the required protection, this is due to the current regs using the voltage range of 230V and not 240V calc this and you will come up with 2990 watts, and as you have stated the IMM heater is 3KW no diversity allowed 100%, and as for the shower pump is the plug top located out side the zones, if so then this would be ok acording to current regs, under a bath with a fixed panel screwd would also meet current regs, as this is clased as having to use a tool to gain access to under the bath, but must be fused acording to raiting of pump.
If not no cert can be issued for work, pump does not require one if out side zone on plug top. but IMM heater will.

 

[Martin Bradley]

Ps as for the IMM heater being on circuit with pump, sorry but this is a ano can do, IMM heater as Markie says if over 15liter should be on dedicated circuit.
http://www.electriciansforums.net/members/markiesparkie.html