Industry failing us

[Jonson]

I just wanted to post a bit of a moan I suppose, i think it's ashame how electrical industry falling to peices, with all these short courses on offer to part time cowboys, what happened to 4 year apprenticeships then calling yourself a spark, no wonder wages are rubbish and standard of work is poor, calling yourself a spark when you have done your theory, do you reckon these guys can bend conduit and submit decent work. I know it's a moan but frustrating for us apprenticeship trained guys, what's other peops views on this

 

[mickys86]

Like I said mate, it could be the photo. Still at least you can take constructive criticism without sulking. As for specsavers; well thats your opinion.

But you try speaking to a spark like that on site mate!!!!

Sulking?? Far from sulking mate and all of the sparks I've worked with have been able to take a joke so as long as I'm not on site with u one day I think I'll get by just fine

 

[mickys86]

Nobody,especially me...is going to claim that all apprentice trained sparks are the dogs danglies......The point I made, and stand by is that since fast track training became the norm there has been a significant increase in incompetance....Yes there are incompetant apprentice trained electricians,just as there are incompetant quickie electricians....but there is a lot more incompetance now than there ever was.

Arguably the best comment on this thread

 

[millwall ken]

Sulking?? Far from sulking mate and all of the sparks I've worked with have been able to take a joke so as long as I'm not on site with u one day I think I'll get by just fine

Top man, believe me you'd love to work with me mate. I though that you said that you could take criticism? Obviously you can't though, as you choose to reply with sarky comments.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Lets not get personal fella's......:cool3:

 

[VoltzElectrical]

What about the member who I descibe who is a so called time served spark directing a company but has to ask if its possible to wire domestic in flex and if he did and IR test right on a plug!!!

My question about wiring a house in flex was fully explained on the thread. And YES, I DID ask about doing a test on an appliance, because testing appliances is something new to me. I've never been afraid to ask about things that are new to me. What's so wrong with that?

Don't try and goad me into an argument, because it's not there.

 

[VoltzElectrical]

TBH these threads are only ending one way - thread closed. Rightly so, 'cos we can't seem to get it together as a trade. At least that's what it seems on these bitchin' threads.

Right now, I couldn't give a hoot.

Any one who wants to further contribute and fuel this pointless exercise, then carry on.

I'll continue to add where I feel I can contribute usefully.

And I'll seek advice when I need to too.

I don't expect to be berated for either.

Where I am right now, I'll go back to teaching.

Don't bother to reply, I ain't interested.

 

[grimysparks80]

II would have loved to have done a 'proper apprenticeship'. I actually started with a good firm doing a college refurb who offered me one, but was laid off before it started. (my own fault. too much drinking, not enough working) It took a me over a year to find someone else to take me on and that was on the basis that i sorted out and paid for my college myself and worked 4 days a week while doing it. i did the 236 pts 1 & 2 and wasnt allowed out on my own until id passed my exams and the other sparks agreed i was ready.
It wasnt too far from an apprenticeship and i was lucky to be paired with a really good spark who genuinley cared about teaching me properly.
Looking back i would have been just as good at my job if id never been to college and terrible if id only been to college.
I think its the onsite training from experienced sparks thats really missing from fast track courses and causing a lot of problems in this industry.
Having said that there are always exeptions to the rule and i knew one really good spark who was virtually self taught.

 

[Engineer54]

Just when people knock you as a spark because you never sat one and judge it on conduit.

I think a lot of the reasons the time served older electricians quote conduit, is that so few coming out of these short training periods these days can work in it , or trunking come to that!!!

They also know that most of this new influx of electricians are only being trained (if you can call it that) to a standard to be able to undertake domestic type installations. That as you say, this is now beginning to affect the domestic side of the industry adversely, mainly by the lack of competency that was once taken for granted. Not really these new boy's fault, but the very real lack of training and experience, in all areas i would say, not just on the practical hands on side, but the theory side of things too....

As for those knocking you, those here should know from your previous comments on conduit, on other threads, that your not into conduit work, Not that you can't bend conduit, you have stated many times you can and have in the past, just that it's not your thing.... That doesn't degrade you from being a fully qualified electrician in my book, far from it....

 

[Electricalserv]

My question about wiring a house in flex was fully explained on the thread. And YES, I DID ask about doing a test on an appliance, because testing appliances is something new to me. I've never been afraid to ask about things that are new to me. What's so wrong with that?

Don't try and goad me into an argument, because it's not there.

Not goading you at all. Just stateing factual matter. You call me a labourer but ask some bad questions for a time served spark. Philpot

 

[grimysparks80]

I agree. some sparks talk about conduit and tray as if its the be all and end all. As a domestic spark i occasionally use conduit and never use tray.
It doent make me a bad spark. Its just not appropriate in the work i do.

P.S. how do you get those speech bubbles to show up?
Im just clicking reply with quote and it looks much better the way you guys are doing it.

 

[VoltzElectrical]

Not goading you at all. Just stateing factual matter. You call me a labourer but ask some bad questions for a time served spark. Philpot

At least you spelt my last name correctly, and you have internet access to companies house.

Show me a thread where I said I was a time served spark.

Show me a thread where I stated i was an all singing spark like YOU mr 2391.

I'M going to bed now before I tell you what 99% of people here know what you are.

Because of what you are, you got banned before. You're a troll. and 99% of us hope you wither on the vine. It was so easy to spot your reemergence DoBBY because you're translucent.

You do what you do. You ain't no labourer, but you don't help yourself with your comments. 99% of us here wish you would ...off and leave us with a tidy forum.

Scum

 

[alarm man]

and i thought i was bitter...cough..:whatchutalkingabout

 

[sparks_114]

Oh one day there'll be so many jobs going round you all will be too occupied to do this to each other. Oh that day where is it!

 

[ezzzekiel]

I stand by what i say that being able to bend a bit of steel has sod all to do with electric and is a skill that can be learned very quickly.

electrical theory as taught now is what counts, understanding how electric can be put to work safely is the key factor after that it all depends on wether you can knock a nail in or how long it takes you to learn.

To the original op:
I hold the current quals and about 10 years experience,
2330 level 3
2391
2382
2377
nvq3
jib approved
Napit part p

Do i deserve to hold the title "electician" ?

 

[richy3333]

I just wanted to post a bit of a moan I suppose, i think it's ashame how electrical industry falling to peices, with all these short courses on offer to part time cowboys, what happened to 4 year apprenticeships then calling yourself a spark, no wonder wages are rubbish and standard of work is poor, calling yourself a spark when you have done your theory, do you reckon these guys can bend conduit and submit decent work. I know it's a moan but frustrating for us apprenticeship trained guys, what's other peops views on this

This type of thread comes up regularly and to be honest, I for one am becoming very bored of it. It always generates pages of moaning and vitriol between forum members on what is usually a very friendly forum.

I've come across 'Time served'/apprenticed sparks that were good, I've come across 'Time served'/apprenticed sparks that were rubbish. I've come across sparks that got their qualifications by doing a short course and were good, I've come across similar people that shouldn't be let loose on a Lego train set. Either way there are good and bad electricians.

I've seen plenty of people pass their Part P that shouldn't ever have done - but that's a different argument to what the OP was complaining about.

Evolution occurs in all industries, whether we like it or not. If you dont like the system then do something about changing the industry. Similarly there has always been competition in all industries. OK, nowadays we have to compete against apprenticed/short course sparks. Plus there are the DIY brigade and customer perception on what jobs should cost and what they are prepared to pay.

But one thing is for sure, moaning on here will get nothing accomplished apart from allowing you to vent your spleen and upset people?