Issue with 12v wire LED conversion from halogen

[Shoes70]

I purchased a house that has a really cool 12v halogen setup where two wires are suspended across the ceiling in two different locations, and each of which carries four 50W halogen bulbs. Each has a separate driver and dimmer.

I first replaced the halogen bulbs with 8w LEDs, and they worked fine as long as I had at least one 50w halogen in the chain. I then got ambitious and replaced the driver on each side with a 60w electronic dimmable unit, and I replaced the dimmers with new Leviton z-wave dimmers.

A lot of work, but how I have the same setup (visually) as before, but the behavior is odd. With one set of 7.5w LED MR16s, the setup works fine but doesn’t dim normally. It stays at full power until very low in the dimmer range and then cuts off quickly. This is after I manually adjusted the dimmer min dim setting.

With another set of MR16s — fancy new Soraa dim to warm bulbs - it barely works at all. The bulbs strobe at any low setting and are unusable.

I’m assuming the issue is 12v voltage drop across the steel cabling that’s both supporting the bulbs and transferring the power, but am not sure why that affects only my LEDs and didn’t previously affect the halogens. Is it because the amperage is much lower?

Any ideas on how to fix this? The system is quite cool to look at, in a 90s gallery kind of way, and would like to keep it if possible.

Thanks - Sean

 

[SJD]

Is the new 60W driver designed to dim LEDs? Perhaps post a photo of it showing the markings / model number.

 

[Shoes70]

Is the new 60W driver designed to dim LEDs? Perhaps post a photo of it showing the markings / model number.

Yes, it's supposed to be universal & dimmable, and it's UL Listed. But of course it's a random Chinese product off Amazon. Here's the photo.

In the meantime, I dug out my multimeter and tested the voltage across the wires. With dimmer at 100%, it's 11.98v at the front of the wire, and 11.94v at the end, so the voltage is definitely not the issue.

Also confirmed MR16s are dimmable (in both cases) and 7.5w or 8w each, so 4 of them should be a max of 32w on a 60w driver.

Thanks for your help!

 

[SJD]

A search of the part number comes up with a HITLIGHTS driver that looks exactly like the one you have, apart from the "GOOVER" replaced with "HITLIGHTS". Could be a legitimate alternative brand, or could be some copy.

It could also be the specific combination of the dimmer, the driver and the LEDs that don't work well together.

I'm not familiar with the Leviton z-wave dimmers, but some dimmers allow you to change the dimming mode (leading edge, trailing edge) that may have some effect. Otherwise, I'd perhaps be inclined to test the driver with another known good dimmer that does let you set the mode, and see if the driver behaves better.

 

[Avo Mk8]

A search of the part number comes up with a HITLIGHTS driver that looks exactly like the one you have, apart from the "GOOVER" replaced with "HITLIGHTS". Could be a legitimate alternative brand, or could be some copy.

A search on the UL website to check the UL mark is genuine, reveals that E476239 file number belongs to Hit International Consulting LLC. Maybe 'Goover' is one of their brands? But not registered to them so this driver may well be a copy of the real thing? That model number is listed - edit - I typed it wasn't listed but have found it now.

 

[Shoes70]

A search on the UL website to check the UL mark is genuine, reveals that E476239 file number belongs to Hit International Consulting LLC. Maybe 'Goover' is one of their brands? But not registered to them so this driver may well be a copy of the real thing? That model number is listed - edit - I typed it wasn't listed but have found it now.

Interesting. I wonder if it’s an illegitimate knock off of the better known Hitlights brand? I’m inclined to just wire in a different driver and see if these drivers are the problem. I’ve used these particular Leviton dimmers all over the house, with many different lighting systems, and never had issues anywhere else.

Do you have a brand of LED driver you recommend? Thank you,

S

 

[Avo Mk8]

Do you have a brand of LED driver you recommend? Thank you,

I'm afraid being in the UK I don't have an intimate knowledge of what drivers may be available to you, or which brands are favoured. You can get a steer by looking at suppliers to the trade, and reputable shops. Just not Amazon or eBay!
I know the Leviton products are good, so I have some faith that your dimmers should work with a decent LED driver.

P.S. You could always try a 'Hitlights' driver !

 

[Shoes70]

I'm afraid being in the UK I don't have an intimate knowledge of what drivers may be available to you, or which brands are favoured. You can get a steer by looking at suppliers to the trade, and reputable shops. Just not Amazon or eBay!
I know the Leviton products are good, so I have some faith that your dimmers should work with a decent LED driver.

P.S. You could always try a 'Hitlights' driver !

As a matter of fact, I just ordered some of those and returned the ones I had. I measured a massive voltage drop down to 5.8v on lower dim settings, so despite being "constant voltage" these drivers are certainly not constant. That explains why the LEDs were behaving so erratically, given that they expect 12v all the time.

I've used Hitlights before and they've worked ... unlike these.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[Avo Mk8]

I measured a massive voltage drop down to 5.8v on lower dim settings, so despite being "constant voltage" these drivers are certainly not constant. That explains why the LEDs were behaving so erratically, given that they expect 12v all the time.

Really you would need to look at the waveform coming out of the driver with an oscilloscope to see if the voltage remained constant. If you were measuring the chopped output from the driver with a multimeter, I think it would 'integrate' the spikes and display a lower voltage than the peak of the waveform. So probably not a fair test. Or to put it another way, I wouldn't be surprised if another driver does the same thing, even if it works the led's properly!
I hope you get to sort it.

PS Ignore me if you did measure with a 'scope!

 

[Shoes70]

Really you would need to look at the waveform coming out of the driver with an oscilloscope to see if the voltage remained constant. If you were measuring the chopped output from the driver with a multimeter, I think it would 'integrate' the spikes and display a lower voltage than the peak of the waveform. So probably not a fair test. Or to put it another way, I wouldn't be surprised if another driver does the same thing, even if it works the led's properly!
I hope you get to sort it.

PS Ignore me if you did measure with a 'scope!

Oh, man, that's beyond my pay grade! I understand what you're saying but do not own an 'scope, so hopefully I just luck out with the new drivers. I can't honestly imagine what else it could be — the MR16s work normally in other systems in the house, and the dimmers are new out of the box and are used everywhere (with success) in this house, so by process of elimination it kind of has to be the drivers. I hope!