Kinve panel thoughts/experience

Hi all,

We're considering representing this manufacturer. In the process of our own due diligence at the moment (performance warranty by Munich RE is a good start) but would value your thoughts/feedback if poss pls

Andy
 
FB has them on his roof near Cambridge. Seems quite happy with them. I'm sure he'll report back. Specs from his signature:

15 x 250W Kinve KV250-60M = 3.75kWp.
PowerOne Aurora PVI-3600-UK (indoor model).
Cambridgeshre, East-South-East facing, 40 degree tilt, no shading.
Jan2012-Jan2013 approx 3300kWh (SAP target approx 3000kWh, Climate-SAF-PVGIS target approx 3300kWh)


Aren't they very similar to Caymax / CEEG?
 
Not a bad panel but better panels exist out there with lower temperature coefficients, that generate well in bright light / low light conditions from a range of manufacturers.
If you live in sunnier parts of the UK they work reasonably well.
 
they're not covered for high ammonia environments in the warranty, and don't have any ammonia test certs on their website, although I have seen a data sheet that says they are ammonia rated. At the very least that's worth clarifying with them as they shouldn't be used on most farms if not, but I know of at least one company that is (as we competed against them and won the contract on that basis).
 
Thanks for all the input guys, much appreciated. I've checked and they are not badging any product for other brands so, whilst their may be similar products out there, they are not made by Kinve and Kinve don't sub-contract to any other manufacturer.

Gavin - I checked this already and have a copy of the Ammonia cert from Dec 2011 (Italian test house).
 
FB has them on his roof near Cambridge. Seems quite happy with them. I'm sure he'll report back. Specs from his signature:

15 x 250W Kinve KV250-60M = 3.75kWp.
PowerOne Aurora PVI-3600-UK (indoor model).
Cambridgeshre, East-South-East facing, 40 degree tilt, no shading.
Jan2012-Jan2013 approx 3300kWh (SAP target approx 3000kWh, Climate-SAF-PVGIS target approx 3300kWh)


Aren't they very similar to Caymax / CEEG?

When I had them installed, there was very little information about them. I figured that someone was paying me 43p (now 45p) per kWh so I'd give them a go in the name of science.

Performance is about average compared to other systems on PVOutput (but I manually enter generation meter rather than trust to an unpredictable add-on device which seem to give figures all over the place).

On the level playing field of the Sheffield database (where everyone enters data from OFGEM-approved generation meter) and when the somewhat East of SouthEast facing of my array is taken into consideration using the "performance ratio" option in the drop-down menu, my panels are usually better than average for my area - but there may be other reasons to explain this.
I am URN 774
Welcome to the UK wide network of PV generators - Microgen Database.

So I would say that Kinve are probably just as acceptable as any other panel. Maybe slightly better in some areas, maybe slightly worse in others.

The test of time will be the most important; there's no way to be sure how long something will last when exposed to the elements and there's no way to tell which manufacturers will still be around in many years to honour any warranty claims.
 
I would be very careful with these panels. The data sheet shows a performance backed warranty issued by Zurich. We had dealings with a solicitor in London representing Zurich as several manufacturers are offering these guarantees that don't exist. Zurich dont offer these guarantees and never have and they are in the process of prosecuting all the firms concerned.
 
Thanks Crusader, that's interesting. Do you have anything in writing to corroborate this?

As far as I am aware, Kinve state that their performance insurance is covered by Munich RE, link to download the cert here

I'm not au-fait with any difference between "Zurich" and Munich RE but I'll see what I can find out,

Andy
 
We were asked to look at a quote today for a client where they had been quoted for Kinve 240 polys. I spotted that the data sheet showed the Zurich guarantee. I emailed the solicitor with the data sheet and they confirmed the Zurich situation. They even wanted to know who the quote was for and who it had been quoted by.
 
Ok, I've been able to clarify this with a little research, something maybe you should have done yourself Crusader?

Kinve have 3 different insurance provisions. Zurich covers their product liability insurance only, whether Zurich do this for any other manufacturer, I know nothing about. Chubb provides their logistics insurance (transport damage including marine) and Munich RE covers their product and performance warranty. Apparently there are at least 100,000 Kinve panels in use in the UK with zero failures or defects that weren't a result of logistics/transport damage. Their insurance overview pasted below for anyone that's interested. It's always good to get to the truth of these things, thanks to all who have provided input.

Chubb Insurance

From the time the product leaves our production facility it is protected against any damage in transport
until the good are delivered directly to your warehouse which covers marine insurance during sea
freight. Any products damage in transport are replaced.

Zurich Insurance

Manufacturers Error Omission Insurance Policy and Product Liability Insurance Policy

Munich RE

Kinve have signed an agreement and insurance with Munich Re, one of the world’s leading reinsurers.
This innovative insurance solution was specifically designed for solar energy PV extended warranty
insurance is based on co-insurance structure that meets the long-term needs of installation.

 Limited Product warranty / ten years, repair, replace or refund - including field replaceable DC
connector cables assemblies, to be free from defects in materials and workmanship under normal
application, installation, use and service conditions.
 Limited peak power warranty - Kinve Solar warrants the output power of the modules will be no less
than 90% of the rated power (lower limit value) under Standard Test Conditions for a period of 10
years since the date of B/L and 80 % at 25 years.

This agreement will cover all crystalline PV-Modules sold by Kinve Solar as of January 1st 2012 and will
back up the performance warranties provided by Kinve against excessive power loss within the next 25
years. In order to provide our clients with greater investment security Kinve have implemented the
highest standard of production equipment and quality control systems to achieve new Munich RE
insurance to improve our processes and product reliability.
Munich RE underwrites the performance of the panels over their lifetime. The strength of this coverage
re-enforces the product reliability and credibility. This coverage enables suitable finance in investment
to be raised particularly in larger commercial projects to provide confidence for lifetime yields and
payback of installations.
The procedure follows that all panels must be tested under Standard Test Condition (STC) for solar cells
in the Air Mass 1.5 spectrum, an incident power density of 1,000 W cm², and at a temperature of 25 °C
defined in international standards IEC 61215. All recorded inspection flash test data is supplied to and
stored by Munich RE. If performance has been reduce as a result of a) faulty manufacturing, b) material
defects or c) material ageing a claim can be made which is verified by Independent expert in a
comparative STC test.
Munich RE made inspection of manufacturing facilities and will continue to conduct audits or inspect
records periodically to maintain standards.

About Munich RE;

Munich Re stands for exceptional solution-based expertise, consistent risk management, financial
stability and client proximity. This is how Munich Re creates value for clients, shareholders and staff. In
the financial year 2009, the Group – which pursues an integrated business model consisting of insurance
and reinsurance – achieved a profit of €2.56bn on premium income of around €41bn. It operates in all
lines of insurance, with around 47,000 employees throughout the world. With premium income of
around €25bn from reinsurance alone, it is one of the world's leading reinsurers. Especially when clients
require solutions for complex risks, Munich Re is a much sought-after risk carrier. The primary insurance
operations are mainly concentrated in the ERGO Insurance Group. With premium income of over €17bn,
ERGO is one of the largest insurance groups in Europe and Germany. It is the market leader in Europe in
health and legal expenses insurance, and 40 million clients in over 30 countries place their trust in the
services and security it provides. In international healthcare business, Munich Re pools its insurance and
reinsurance operations, as well as related services, under the Munich Health brand. Munich Re’s global
investments amounting to €182bn are managed by MEAG, which also makes its competence available to
private and institutional investors outside the Group
 

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