Kitchen Electrics and the law

[tonys]

As the claimant put their claim together yet and if so it will say what the grounds are ?

 

[chiplard]

IMHO if you didn't quote to alter the electrical installation and your fitters didn't, then you cant be held responsible.

If you quoted to fit a 'kitchen', then you wouldn't be responsible for anything other than fitting a kitchen.

If I gave a quote to rewire a kitchen I certainly wouldn't be responsible for fitting cabinets!!!!

I would however consult a good solicitor as the wording of quotes, estimates, T&Cs etc etc, mean something completely different to us as they would to the legal world!!

 

[nickblake]

take all your paper work in and go and speak to trading standards and see what they say , they may be able to advise you too

 

[tonys]

take all your paper work in and go and speak to trading standards and see what they say , they may be able to advise you too

They do represent/advise business's as far as I know.

 

[bugsy]

I think that as you have only supplied the appliances and only installed the appliances you should be o.k. ( if they went to curry's and bought a washing machine and freezer and they delivered and installed woud he be suing them?)
However if you produced a drawing showing the kitchen layout which included socket outlets etc you may be on a sticky wicket.
Additional they may argue that the installation should have been tested ( they may argue fit for purpose ) and you should shown due diligange and tested everything prior to installation

Difficult situation

 

[i=p/u]

youve done something wrong cause you seem scared.... did you move sockets?????

 

[oldtimer]

OK I have a stab here first of all you need to go back to the "electrician" who was working in another part of the house and then did his Kwik Fit Fitter bit ie sucking air through his teeth trying to spook his customer into getting more work you also need to request from the customer any documentation
pertaining to his complaint from any third party ie the spark who kicked this all off you should also advise the customer that as far as you are concerned
you will be looking for costs. as for 3 sockets being fed from a 6mm cooker circuit this holds no water and the only thing wrong here would be is if the circuit protection is still 30 amps instead of 16 or 20 amps and you were not to know this. One thing though can you confirm that the cooker circuit was supplying 3 twin sockets only and not 3 twin sockets and the cooker and even if it was the customer will have to provide details of who and when this work was done ie a sparky guy from the pub or he did it or a local sparkie company in other words it is not for you to prove you are right it is the customer who needs to prove you were wrong.
I think this guy is a chancer because if it was a car and your job was to put new trim on it then common law says your resposabilty is only for the trim not the dodgy braking system someone else fitted 5 years previously

 

[jo4nny8]

youve done something wrong cause you seem scared.... did you move sockets?????

No not at all

im worried because a customer is taking me to court and you read in the papers all the time about companies getting shafted. what with all the cowboy builder stuff on the telly it automatically makes people think they have a case.

This particular is trying it on and the 'independant' assement she got of the works we carried out are so stupid its unreal, like for example we didnt seal down the inside of cabinets where the base of the cabinet meets the side panels, we didnt fill in the holes in the cabinets inside where the shelf pegs go and we fitted everything second hand. Its a complete joke but it still is worrying the fact that she could go into court, start crying and the judge will fall for it

 

[telectrix]

if you can prove the customer is lying on even 1 small point, then you should win hands down

 

[robsparky1975]

Sounds to me like the customer is pulling a fast one,if your not a qualified electrician then how could you possiibly know,surely a court will see the sense in this,if its in black & white on your quote fit kitchen(not alter sockets,or plumbing or gas pipes)then thats all you have done no more no less,the electrics are his problem.

 

[MFHEng]

He is quoting BS7671:2008 as says we should have rectified the electrics to this standard!

Is there anywhere i can get proof that its only installations performed after july 2008 that have to be compliant?

1. When you say he is quoting BS7671 , what regulation/regulations is he quoting ?
2. When you say you have plugged "everything in", is this a euphamism for wiring the cooker in to an outlet plate or is it connected by a BS1363 plug

 

[saveloy]

Apart from the electrical side, have you been offered an opportunity to rectify the other "defects"? And also were you paid in full for the job on completion?

 

[rodney12]

I'd be interested to know what works the spark was doing on the installation

 

[simpson93]

apart from all the sueing and claiming and what not why dont you call up the customer arrange to meet up show him what he sighned and explain that it isnt your fault.(advise him to come on here and ask for advice)

 

[Paul.M]

Here is a few useful definitions taken from the wiring regs (17th ed).

Appliance, An item of current using equipment. (note not hard wired).

Circuit, An assembly of electrical equipment supplied from the same origin. (hard wired installation that you have not changed or altered).

Cold tail, The interface between the fixed installation and a heating unit. (i think it can be used in your case. The cable coming from the cooker to the cooker connector is not classed as part of the fixed installation).

Connector, The part of a cable coupler or of an appliance coupler which........ to be attached to the end of the flexible cable remote from the supply. (the cooker connector that is part if the circuit but you have not altered the circuit by connecting the cooker).

Design current, The magnitude of the current to be carried by the circuit in normal service. (eg you didn't overload the circuit be putting in a higher rated cooker).

Fault, A circuit condition in which current flows through an abnormal or unintended path. (you have not created a fault)

Testing, Implementation if measures to assess an electrical "installation" (you have not installed any circuits, you have just plugged in 2 appliances and connected a cooker).

Instructed person, A person adequately advised or supervised "by skilled persons" to enable him/her to avoid dangers which electricity may create. (you are not a skilled person with the respects of electricity and its not your responsibility).


If I read your posts correctly you have not done anything wrong. A little bit more info on the cooker would be nice, what was the current rating of the old and new cooker? What is the complaint word for word made against you?

Think I speak for most of us on here when I say that we will help you as much as possible to get this CHANCER off your back and so you can continue trading. Good luck and keep us informed.