New Install Done

[Anna Howard]

MrDeo if you are unhappy as you obviously are then you should be complaining to the people that did the installation there are rules and guidlines for them to follow. Then if you are still unhappy (i suspect you will be) then take it to REAL and MCS.

Why am I wasting my time on this?

Are you sure that the guidelines mentioned on the manual regarding installation are what you should be going for and following in order to solve this problem.....

 

[MrDeo]

Yea, I was going to talk to the installer when he comes around (sometime) next week. I have no fear of the roof falling in or even water ingress (in the short term). I have no documentation for the system yet as he's going to do all handoffs after all of the deadline jobs are done. I just wasn't sure if the above items were even issues at all, would rather not nag the installer when everything might actually be okay. Even with the tiles being kicked up a bit there's still plenty of slope and overlap, just was worried about them rocking and such.

 

[Olias]

MrDeo if you are unhappy as you obviously are then you should be complaining to the people that did the installation there take it to REAL and MCS.

Agree, raise the issue with the installation company; it has to have a complaints procedure in place. If you're not happy with the response go to the installer's Certification Body (NICEIC, Napit or whoever).

 

[sambotc]

Personally never had a job where the cables can't go through the lap in the felt, although sometimes even doing this the felt rips slightly depending on the condition. Had one on thursday where the felt was fitted stupidly tight, but thankfully it was new so managed to get them in without ripping.
We fit for a rent a roof company (sorry!) and they don't want tiles notched for strength reasons, normally we try and get the bracket to fit on the left hand side of the tile so that the kick up is covered by the tile to the left as it raises also, avoiding a gap. This isn't always possible so we have left tiles kicked up in the past and never had an issue so far. Personally i'd rather they were not left like that but.... presumably the broken tiles have been changed with ones outside the array now so they can be easily replaced?

Give them a chance to sort the issues, its a tough time for all at the moment but no one can say leaving broken tiles on the roof is acceptable surely?

 

[JulianC]

We fit for a rent a roof company (sorry!) and they don't want tiles notched for cost reasons,

Fixed that for ya fella :rofl:

This not notching tiles due to strength issues is a nonsense. Strength against what? A particularly fat pigeon landing on them? This is not just me saying this - I've just come back from a day at Redland where they were happy to talk about their forthcoming roof hooks....that require the tile to be notched to fit back flush over the top. Rather that than leave them sitting proud so the wind and wind driven rain can get under them.

 

[powervan]

lol ok ok calm down calm down!! yes u payed to much! but u do get the FIT at top rate! fitters are busy so why not make some money because they wont be after this for a while! nice if u can get wires through flap in felt but not always possible! if it has TORN like some old stuff has in the past then just ask them to return (when the madness is over to repair that) ref tiles well its a personal thing (down to the man doing the job) the main thing is your roof is still watertight how ever they did it !! so put your fairy lights up ! stuff the turkey ! and CHILL !!

 

[sambotc]

Fixed that for ya fella :rofl:

This not notching tiles due to strength issues is a nonsense. Strength against what? A particularly fat pigeon landing on them? This is not just me saying this - I've just come back from a day at Redland where they were happy to talk about their forthcoming roof hooks....that require the tile to be notched to fit back flush over the top. Rather that than leave them sitting proud so the wind and wind driven rain can get under them.

Yep your not far wrong there! We also fit for a few other companies one being a 'market leader' type outfit and they all insist on tiles being notched, 6mm AC runs for minimum volt drop etc. They pay more for it though, I think my bosses attitude is if thats what they want and won't pay us to do it, thats what they get.. fair enough i guess? It's all certificated through the rent a roof companies system so no come backs on our side, and we have it in writing should it ever arise.

 

[SolarCity]

Biggs this guys come on here just to pick holes)) in his installation just like the many before him and the many that will follow. Advice about problems is one thing but running down another installer without seeing the job is something else.

Torn through the felt? how large is this tear? some claim to put conduit under a tile to run the cables through and everyone wants it. At this point I could say what I would say face to face but.................

I'm not running down the installer, I'm criticising his install.

At this point I could say what I would say face to face but.................

er....what?

 

[SolarCity]

My point was, and you obviously missed it we anyone can pick holes in anyone elses work.

I'm just giving my opinion that maintaining the integrity of the felt is a pretty fundamental aspect of an install - and pretty simple too.

You are apparently advocating a drop in standards due to the current rush and I strongly disagree with that this acceptable.

 

[SolarCity]

We would, if at all possible go through the lap in the felt and clip the cables to the rafters. Sometimes that's not possible, so we make a hole large enough to pass the cables through.

You will read here at times that making holes (we are not talking of boots size) in the felt is a hanging offense but applying just a little common sense will soon have you on the right track. The tiles weather proof your home, the felt does not and was never intended to.

Out interest, under what circumstances is it not possible to pass the cables through overlap in the felt? I'm not saying that such a scenario doesn't exist, just that I have never experienced it myself.

 

[Earthstore]

Wow there, pistols at dawn or what?
I would like to offer Mrdeo a little advice, if I am allowed?
Just so you can confirm if your installation is up to scratch or not, why don't you contact your council, ask for building control and get them to come out to see if it complies with building regs, most councils charge £102.12,they have a special section for solar panels, or you could apply online.
I have found that building regs are a very contentious area regarding solar panels, most companies believe they are covered under the competent persons scheme, however this does not always include Part A for loadings, part C for water ingress, but they should be covered by part P which is the electrical side.
You will then have a justified complaint to make to your installer, who, I am sure, will be more than willing rectify any faults found.
Once it is all OK, building control will issue you with a completion certificate, which is something you will need if you ever sell your property.
I personally recommend to all my domestic customers to get building regs, and get conformation from planning.
Cross every T and dot every I, then nothing can come back and bite me on the arse.
Hope this helps.

 

[MrDeo]

Thanks for the Advice Earthstore. As said early on, right now I was just looking for advice. Going by replys here (and in other threads) I think the felt will be the only problem, the tiles being up a little doesnt sound like an issue (I searched through a lot of back threads here and on other forums). One structural eng said the roof was sound for the amount of weight that was looking to be placed on it. In total I had 5 quotes, and all 5 installers said that the roof itself was okay (one of those uses their own structural eng).

I thank everyone for their time and replys. I'll push the felt (next week after the rush is over) and hopefully he'll repair it without fuss. Will contact the council as well, not only would it cover me, but it would probably be useful for insurance if I ever need to make a claim and quelling the neighbours who see the new eye-sore.

 

[powervan]

its not cause its an eye-sore its cause U got 43.3p for next 25ys (u just have to live that long) earthstore ! how big is ur arse ?

 

[Markc]

I'm sorry guys but I feel you have been very harsh to the OP on his comments and unjustified in your response's.

As you will now if you have been here some time I am an accredited installer and no matter what my stress level I have always provided a service I would be happy with in my own home and 100% customer satisfaction. No mater what the difficulties with the industry it is not the fault of the customer and as such all customers, at no mater what stage or date, should not expect a substandard installation. Just because of the date this is no excuse for a poor job.

The OP is only asking some questions, NOT slating the installation but raising some concerns he has over his installation at his property. I feel he is justified to ask. Its a pity that my fellow installers sort opportunity to vent off steam as three quite reasonable questions.

To answer the OP's questions,

We trim our tiles where required to do so. This allows the tile to sit back true and flush as it did before the installations. We have asked several professional roofers about this action and the census of opinion is this is a better action than allowing the strong winds to blow the tile off the roof. The primary defense of weathering is the tile however with a panel fitted above this is reduced. The question over rain pushing up and under the tile is no more or less than before. The trimmed material should only allow for the bracket and no more. Again with a panel above this action will be reduced. Not all roofers agree however with the above argument put forth there is food for thought.

On the DC cables. It is not a requirement to duct the cables but the MCS code requires the cable entry should be weather proof and allow the cable free movement with out snagging. If the cable entry is tight the cables will become damaged and possibly dangerous due to exposed live conductive parts (the inner conductor in this case) Good practice would be to cut a grove in the low edge of the tile to allow for the cable and lead flash the tile entirely. Alternatively there are a number of cable entry tiles available now which replace the tile entirely. (We do not use these ourselves I will add)

The cable entry should not be pushed through the felt or a hole made by the installer for it either. Good practice is to use the existing overlap joint between two layers of felt. This way the original protection is not reduced. The cables must be supported on their entire length (BS7671) and labelled accordingly. A flexible duct (Koppex) will offer limited mechanical protection but this is not a regulation for a loft installation but does make good working practice IMO.

 

[solarsavings]

Out interest, under what circumstances is it not possible to pass the cables through overlap in the felt? I'm not saying that such a scenario doesn't exist, just that I have never experienced it myself.

How about 1500mm breathable membrane or finding the lap on a slate roof. Not all of us can walk on water some just have to do their best.