New smart meters to turn off supply remotely

[Gavin John Hyde]

Just been told about a proposal by some companies to allow them to turn off your power without notice or compensation if the grid is under strain.
If they haven't learnt already from the smart meter shambles that its best to leave alone they now want to mess it up again.
In theory if too many people are charging electric cars they could turn off yours so it stops charging but also your whole house goes off!
Not sure how that would stand up in court if you turned Mrs jones medical machine off and she stops breathing in her sleep! I think turning somebody's power off without notice would likely lead to a few high court challenges.
I have long thought ev chargers should have a separate meter like the old eco7 system.
Personally, if they made this mandatory and turned mine off, the seal fairy would become very popular and start bypassing the meter!
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/bills/article-8706033/Smart-meters-used-switch-electricity-without-warning-compensation.html

 

[Strima]

I don't think it would end well for the power companies.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

There is a section in the EV Code of Practice 4 all about smart meters.
These things are going to get smarter and smarter (excuse the pun)

 

[snowhead]

Firstly DNO's have always been aware of any household with any with essential medical equipment and will make alternative arrangements if needed.

The actual plan is NOT as sensationally headlined by the MAIL, no surprise there.
In the article it states a 3rd Gen Smart meter will be required and selective high load appliances could be turned off, not the whole house.
Presumably the plan is to have separate circuits from the 3rd Gen meter so only those will be switched off.

It's likely that this will only apply to new builds as circuit reconfiguration will be required.
U.K Gov won't be forcing existing households to have to spend money doing that.

There is already the facility to remotely turn of / reduce load on more recent E.V chargers

Link doesn't work, here's another;

Emergency measures could allow networks to switch off household power

A series of backdoor 'modifications' to the Smart Energy Code have been proposed by officials and look set to pass into law by next spring.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[plugsandsparks]

Just planning a dual EV set up for a house. Happens to already have a TP live service head. Have requested separate meter on 2nd phase, see what happens.

It gets worse though, they are also looking at using EVs as a potential battery source to supplement the grid. So you arrive home with half a battery and think i will get it fully charged ready for long journey in the morning but no, the grid grabs a bit to help when the kettles go on and in the morning you have less than you started with .. lol

 

[Timbo]

All the more reason to stick with my diesels, then!?

 

[Dartlec]

Be nice if they put a non-smart isolator in them too, to allow board changes without the visit from the seal fairy!

Given they've only just managed to get the 1st Gen smart meters to talk to anyone but the original supplier, I'm not confident it will happen for a long time even if they decide on a standard.

Then of course a lot of the thousands of new builds that are going up around me (Ebbsfleet garden city) have drives or car parking immediately near the house, so EV charging is going to be a tricky upgrade for most of them!
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The actual plan is NOT as sensationally headlined by the MAIL, no surprise there.

I'm shocked I tell you!

In the article it states a 3rd Gen Smart meter will be required and selective high load appliances could be turned off, not the whole house.
Presumably the plan is to have separate circuits from the 3rd Gen meter so only those will be switched off.

Be interesting to see how they do that - tails to 2 boards? The return of split tariff boards? What happens when an "electrician" changes the board and commons the tails with a Henley block? Unless it is specified in BS7671 and/or laid down in law then it likely won't happen.

Could see it perhaps coming in for EV chargers, but then what about key workers like paramedics who may have their emergency vehicle at home and need it to be ready to go in the morning - will the meter be 'smart' enough to prioritise?

No doubt will end up with the energy companies charging higher tariffs for those who want their Tesla to be guaranteed to charge overnight.....

 

[freddo]

I thought the new meters communicated with 'smart' appliances to control them, rather than having 2 consumer units etc.

 

[Zerax]

I think there's alot of sense in using battery solutions... you have the 'vanity' products like Tesla's Powerwall already, but are very expensive. When we start to get large numbers of 'second user' EV batteries on the market, I think the whole battery solution will become economic for most.

When this happens, having some sort of grid balancing/sharing going on will become common place. The only issue then will be those long, still and dank winter evenings when we have no solar, no wind but everyone wants to put the oven on/make tea/charge the cars etc. We're gonna need some pretty big batteries...

 

[littlespark]

Think of our call outs...

“my powers all off!”

“I’ll be there soon”

“hmm.... smart meter? Your power company has turned you off... that’ll be £120 call out charge thanks”

 

[Vortigern]

This is old news. The capability to turn off supplies remotely has been around for donkeys years. Think eco 7 switching they have a remote signal system, nothing new here.

 

[snowhead]

“hmm.... smart meter? Your power company has turned you off... that’ll be £120 call out charge thanks”

But for and extra £(insert figure here) I just happen to have an App that will block the Smart meter signal.

The Eco 7 Teleswitch signal is from a BBC transmitter and will affect everyone in the area.
On older installations it will turn off the off peak supply, in newer installations it'll just switch the metering from Off peak rate to normal rate, no loss of power.

If the New Smart meters are going to communicate with appliances to turn them off then there would have to be legislation to make the installation of suitably enabled appliances compulsory where 3rd gen meters are fitted and they'd have to be constantly monitored to prevent interference / disabling of the communication.
And make it an offence to interfere with them.

U.K Gov or whoever couldn't get the Landlords / regs legislation right, there's no chance of the above happening.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I remember something along the lines that an electrical supply and water come to that, can not be turned off by the supplying company no matter what the circumstances, there where a few court case's where this was tried and it came about because of "Elderly" "Children" "Dependant medical" etc.
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If the New Smart meters are going to communicate with appliances to turn them off then there would have to be legislation to make the installation of suitably enabled appliances compulsory where 3rd gen meters are fitted and they'd have to be constantly monitored to prevent interference / disabling of the communication.
And make it an offence to interfere with them.

Or a change to the CU installation to use power shredders to switch off each appliance in turn according to its priority, but then they would have to be on a dedicated circuit as the habit of plugging our appliances into the FRC would prevent this from working.

 

[ChipFanDave]

Dynamic demand is already used in industry. It allows for high electrical use equipment to be stopped or started to balance the grid.

 

[EricMark]

Across the road from me, the milkman decided to use an electric van for his round, Renault Kangoo long wheel base, it is claimed to have a range of 100 miles, his round is 68 miles, so a reasonable leeway, he gets recovered around 3 times a year when Police stop him crawling up local duel carriageway as his batteries are on last leg, most of the time he is OK, but if anything stops him getting a full charge in the afternoon, evening and up to around 3 am when he starts round, then he will not make it home.

If his charging is interrupted or reduced it really causes a problem. Not only for him, also anyone stuck behind him, and the recovery service if he does not make it. It seems the charger auto reduces charge if the house is drawing too much, he likes the electric van, he says being so quiet it is ideal at 6 am on a housing estate. He never uses a heater, he wants milk cold, demister is only drain. As he says even when battery nearly flat still going faster than old type milk float, but turning off power to van charging would mean he would have to return to fossil fuels.