outdoor heater circuit with pir....

[pennywise]

Is this for a pub?

 

[Davey101]

Agreed mate, the PIR is switching the coil, not the load. The only difference between mine and your advice is that I am switching the loads through switches (via the contactor).
A 20 amp MK grid switch would presumably be up to the job, unless I am missing something?

Cheers, Dave.

 

[baldsparkies]

Agreed mate, the PIR is switching the coil, not the load. The only difference between mine and your advice is that I am switching the loads through switches (via the contactor).
A 20 amp MK grid switch would presumably be up to the job, unless I am missing something?

Cheers, Dave.

No mate I was missing something your making sense, its been a long day One less contactor your way so your round with the saved money mate
Just noticed pennywise suggested the pub, maybe its his round, LOL.

 

[pennywise]

Just put a 2 gang 20amp materseal switch in and no PIR, If you get too hot just turn one off keep it simple.

 

[Davey101]

Just put a 2 gang 20amp materseal switch in and no PIR, If you get too hot just turn one off keep it simple.

I actually partly agree with this, but if the OP wants a PIR, then so be it. To be fair, it would be pretty easy to leave the heaters on for long periods, wasting a fair bit of money.

 

[pennywise]

We use these on pub smoking areas, up to 2hr time out function and you can cancel the timer anytime you like. They do a PIR version too


Outdoor Pushbutton Timer - Energyoutdoor - Products - Elkay

 

[uksel]

I would definitely be doing this in conduit & singles & run everything to/from a large (300x220) weatherproof adaptable box

and you only need a single contactor with your latest setup as you are switching the common supply

and weatherproof switches would handle the 6-7 amps per heater, these probably wouldn't do that much on load switching, the contactor would be doing that

 

[85mick85]

hi one thing to watch is the amp rating on the pir, may be to small for the heaters

 

[Davey101]

I like Monty Python as much as the next man, but there's a limit....................

 

[reese646]

Firstly a BIG THANKS to everyone so far for your input, glad to of got so many people's cog's turning, plus I don't know if i can click thanks too everyone on the thread lol

So if I wired as in my last drawing, but used an enclosure housing a 1 pole contactor (only used a 2 because I can't find a 1 pole on the internet so far, but any suggestions would be gratefully accepted....) a din rail rather than all the junction boxes, and 2 outdoor light switches (which your telling me would handle the ampage fine) then the drawing all looks good

and the pir in the drawing could be a cheap unit as found in most outdoor security lights as its only switching not carrying the load.....

if thats all correct I think I'm sorted, this is for an outdoor smoking area at my house, I have alot of parties on the weekend and currently have a gas heater, and from experience once everyones in the party spirit they leave it on alot, hence the pir so my electric bill doesn't go crazy.....just so you know the background, I feel you all deserve it after the response lol

 

[uksel]

good luck

how's about an invite to one of these parties then

 

[reese646]

We use these on pub smoking areas, up to 2hr time out function and you can cancel the timer anytime you like. They do a PIR version too


Outdoor Pushbutton Timer - Energyoutdoor - Products - Elkay

out of interest PENNYWISE these say 16a for the push and pir, but no mention of wattage limit.....going off on a bit of a tangent here but could this switch a 3kw load or wouldn't it be suitable......

 

[pennywise]

They can do a maximum of a 16amp resistive and inductive based loads, 3.680Kw.

 

[uksel]

food for thought:

you'll be regularly switching an operating current of about 13A, which is less than the rated current of the device but it could reasonably degrade quickly as it will be breaking on-load currents. that 16A rating could also mean rated at an operating current of 16A for 6 hours, and not switching on-load currents on and off every 5 minutes when someone stands up

bear in mind the surge startup currents of these heaters could be substantially more, especially if they are infra-red

 

[reese646]

so out of interest then one of these items would be fine as a make shift control, for both lamps until I get everything together for the final thing, and they'd handle it without a problem????? I'm guessing yes but the chances of the bloke at the screwfix counter knowing the answer is pretty slim lol

food for thought:

you'll be regularly switching an operating current of about 13A, which is less than the rated current of the device but it could reasonably degrade quickly as it will be breaking on-load currents. that 16A rating could also mean rated at an operating current of 16A for 6 hours, and not switching on-load currents on and off every 5 minutes when someone stands up

bear in mind the surge startup currents of these heaters could be substantially more, especially if they are infra-red

so your saying that no these wouldn't do the job?!? just thought they'd do for a makeshift while all the other bits come as I can pick one up at screwfix tomorrow if need be, and yeah I had read somewhere heater have a surge on startup, and if you want to spend alot of money you can buy soft start switches with in-built pir/timer