Part P training . It must be stopped

[Gary Soulsby]

As most of you are aware part p was introduced in 2005. This has lead to a huge surge in people becoming part p registered installers. This is not the issue although anyone who works on electrical installations should have "sufficient" knowledge and training as to minimise risk.

The approved appretiship does this as anyone wanting to become qualified has to obtain level 2&3 technical cert and level 3 NVQ as well as sit the AM2 test.

Currently company's are offering training to become an approved domestic installer in 5 DAYS!!
That isn't even enough time to get someone entirely used to useing the regs book never mind classified as "competent"

In the end of the day these people are taking the easy option, of which I understand but that should not come at the price of safety and the loss of work of approved electricians that have spent 3-5 years training.

Find attacked the link to a petition stop the training of these under qualified "electricians"

Petition: Scrap Part P, someone with 5 days experience is not safe to work on electrics - https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207481/sponsors/new?token=xUnMdAVdRq7xSzVHb68h

 

[Midwest]

With 3 votes as of this time, and without clarification as to what you are signing, I don't think is going to get more votes, at the moment.

As regards defining or whether we should define what is an electrician, your competent in the field of electrickary you are involved. You might start off as a jack of all trades, but pretty much settle into, domestic, commercial & industrial. Keeping it broadly in those zones. As to whether you should be trained into just one of those genre's, I suppose is the debate.

 

[Spoon]

Hi @Gary Soulsby. I do know what you are saying. We all have our limitations. It just sounds very pompous that DI's are not electricians.
Yes I do sound defensive, its just the way I come across. Not a lot I can do about it. I do like to speak my mind.

 

[Pete999]

Hi @Pete999 . The Oxford dictionary thing was cause of the OP saying "Domestic installer is not an Electrician". My personal opinion is that a DI is an electrician.
As I said before, there are some who are DI's on this forum. Most are really nice people who know their limitations.
Yes the industry has declined. It's been declining for decades.
What we need need to stop is the 'Cash hungry Training providers' but I can't see that happening. Truthful proper training is what is needed.

Well said Spoon, I for one hope your hopes come to fruition, the trouble, I think, is that there are far to many people, in positions of, I wont say authority, but I'm sure you get my drift, people with influence, is a better way of describing them, who hold a niche position, and are able to influence the rule makers, you know who I mean don't

Hi @Gary Soulsby. I do know what you are saying. We all have our limitations. It just sounds very pompous that DI's are not electricians.
Yes I do sound defensive, its just the way I come across. Not a lot I can do about it. I do like to speak my mind.

Yes we know Spoon

 

[Spoon]

I'm a nice guy really @Pete999 .... OK, yes.... I'm an ---...

 

[Gary Soulsby]

If they where indeed Electricians would that be applied to the title? Domestic Electrician

 

[Pete999]

I'm a nice guy really @Pete999 .... OK, yes.... I'm an ---...

Don't put yourself down mate, we all like speak our mind sometimes, trouble is I can go far to far and get myself in the Mire, not often but sometimes.

 

[Pete999]

If they where indeed Electricians would that be applied to the title? Domestic Electrician

I'm afraid the title of Electrician has changed, we have Domestic Installer, Domestic, Commercial, Industrial, and now Solar Electricians, I suppose the later ones did their training with Scotty on the Starship Enterprise.?

 

[FatAlan]

Gary. What are the exact details of what you are petitioning parliament for? The link just takes me to a sign in section. I’d like to see the petition details first.

 

[GBDamo]

I think that the scope of what Part P trained domestic installers are allowed to do needs clarifying and probably restricting but, as the BYB only requires a person be competent, ambiguity is built into the system.

For example if, as a DI, your work involves carrying out the same, even complex, task on every job then the training provided by Part P courses can prove sufficient to do the job safely and compliantly.

However if your job requires you to carry out many, even simple, tasks then it is almost impossible for the short courses to provide sufficient knowledge and experience.

In the first instance I would argue you can comfortably demonstrate your competence and in doing so satisfy the requirements of the BYB but in the second you would be very hard pushed to do so.

Rather than throwing the baby out with the bath water I'd say the system need clarification and tightening of the scope.

 

[Spoon]

Don't put yourself down mate, we all like speak our mind sometimes, trouble is I can go far to far and get myself in the Mire, not often but sometimes.

Was just having a laugh mate. I'm fantastic really..... That's why everyone loves me...

 

[Spoon]

I'm afraid the title of Electrician has changed, we have Domestic Installer, Domestic, Commercial, Industrial, and now Solar Electricians, I suppose the later ones did their training with Scotty on the Starship Enterprise.?

Well said mate.
I'd rather get trained on Starship Voyager.. 'Seven of Nine' can teach me any day....

 

[Gary Soulsby]

Gary. What are the exact details of what you are petitioning parliament for? The link just takes me to a sign in section. I’d like to see the petition details first.

It's is regarding the training involved with part p. Specifically the really short 6 day delivery . I will show I hope when over 5 sign . If not I will repost it when the petition goes live

 

[Midwest]

When they stopped handing out apprenticeships like there was no tomorrow, things have had to change. I don't see a problem with someone going on a domestic installers course, if there's such a thing, just to install stuff in kitchens & bathrooms. In an idea world, we would like to back to the days of the 1970's, when you could walk into any company and get an apprenticeship for free. That's no longer the case, and training has to be reflective in that.

If we can no longer afford aircraft carriers a plenty, then apprenticeships are going to be scarce.

 

[The Ghost]

I don't quite understand what your agenda is however your posit that Part P must be stopped is nonsense. No one gets to go onto a competent scheme register with Part P. That is a one day course on building regulations that essentially says if you drill a hole stop it up with either/and/or fireproof/soundproof/weather proof gump.
To be frank wiring a house is not rocket science. Wiring a house to craftsman level takes some years of experience which no course can teach you except the university of life. The science is acknowledged as "basic science" which it is. Are you from some course that wants to do away with the opposition, what is your beef with it all?

 

[Gary Soulsby]

I don't quite understand what your agenda is however your posit that Part P must be stopped is nonsense. No one gets to go onto a competent scheme register with Part P. That is a one day course on building regulations that essentially says if you drill a hole stop it up with either/and/or fireproof/soundproof/weather proof gump.
To be frank wiring a house is not rocket science. Wiring a house to craftsman level takes some years of experience which no course can teach you except the university of life. The science is acknowledged as "basic science" which it is. Are you from some course that wants to do away with the opposition, what is your beef with it all?

Your telling me 23days is sufficient to be able to sign off there own work in a domestic premises ?

Domestic Electrical Installer TS4U-25: Silver - https://www.tradeskills4u.co.uk/courses/domestic-electrician-installer-ts4u25