Quoting for works - How do I challenge NIC/EIC stipulated on requirements

[Lazlo]

I'm NAPIT registered FULL SCOPE which states -
and is therefore approved to undertake the design, construction, maintenance, verification and/or inspection and testing of electrical installations up to 1 kV within the work


SCOPE OF APPROVAL


Work Category Date of Approval Date of Expiry


Electrical installation work in dwellings (A1.1) 26.02.2014 08.12.2015


Electrical installation work in all buildings other than


dwellings and other industrial locations (A1.2)


26.02.2014 08.12.2015

I'm bidding for works that stipulate 'must only be carried out by a fully certified electrical contractor part of the NIC/EIC scheme in accordance with Building Regulation 2004 Part P'

How can that be legal in a tender pack? How do I go about challenging it????

 

[andyb]

No I can't but you are missing my point.

It's because the others aren't advertising properly. At the risk of repeating myself, the NICEIC has had 60 odd years head start.

The attitude you have will not help any of us as the NIC will only get worse. A monopoly is not a good thing.

The thing is Mark, in business you do not have the luxury of being able to change the world. So you have to make a decision based on business principles. Do I go with an organization who are recognized as a brand or market leader and are more often than not specified in tenders? or do I try to change peoples perception of Napit etc and go with them knowing that it will lose me job opportunities?

 

[Guest77]

Yes another bug bear of mine:

It was the electric safe register and the electrical safety register then the competent persons register.

The charity that the NIC profits fund was the Electrical Safety Register but is now called Electrical Safety First!

How many of you know that? More to the point. How many consumers do?


Just goes to show that the whole situation is in utter mayhem and no one has a clue what to do next!

The important consumers the councils and consultancies only know of the NICEIC, like I mentioned earlier which you didn't like, the others cannot match them at the moment and we are all hoping thay get a grip soon because a monopoly is not a good thing for the trade.

 

[markythesparky]

No I can't but you are missing my point.

It's because the others aren't advertising properly. At the risk of repeating myself, the NICEIC has had 60 odd years head start.

The attitude you have will not help any of us as the NIC will only get worse. A monopoly is not a good thing.

The thing is Mark, in business you do not have the luxury of being able to change the world. So you have to make a decision based on business principles. Do I go with an organization who are recognized as a brand or market leader and are more often than not specified in tenders? or do I try to change peoples perception of Napit etc and go with them knowing that it will lose me job opportunities?

You are correct to a point. A lone individual cannot change the world but a group may well be able to.

The view that I will go with the other because that's what the others are doing is similar to the lemming jumping of a cliff.

It will take more than one to break the ball and chain.

 

[andyb]

You are correct to a point. A lone individual cannot change the world but a group may well be able to.

The view that I will go with the other because that's what the others are doing is similar to the lemming jumping of a cliff.

It will take more than one to break the ball and chain.

It's not going with the other sparks Mark it's going with what the customer wants.
What you are saying is all true, but you have to go where the work is. This is why Napit struggle.

 

[Andy78]

It's not going with the other sparks Mark it's going with what the customer wants.
What you are saying is all true, but you have to go where the work is. This is why Napit struggle.

Nope, it's going with what the customer is told by the NICEIC they want. What they get and what they want might be totally different things.

 

[andyb]

Nope, it's going with what the customer is told by the NICEIC they want. What they get and what they want might be totally different things.

Doesn't matter how they get there Andy, it's still their call.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Nope, it's going with what the customer is told by the NICEIC they want. What they get and what they want might be totally different things.

You have to admit that's marketing at its best. Lol

 

[markythesparky]

It's not going with the other sparks Mark it's going with what the customer wants.
What you are saying is all true, but you have to go where the work is. This is why Napit struggle.

Nope, it's going with what the customer is told by the NICEIC they want. What they get and what they want might be totally different things.

absolutely!

And this is what the others need to take on board.

 

[Andy78]

You have to admit that's marketing at its best. Lol

Not denying that at all... but they are a fraudulent and unaccountable entity to my mind that survive only on the tradition of their presence and serve no purpose to industry or safety.

 

[ImpededLoop]

It all comes down to backside covering and NICEIC advertising.

Someone in local government ordering electrical work can be questioned by procurement and others about how they select contractors and judge their competency. The easy answer is to only use NICEIC contractors so they can say that they are inspected annually etc.. It covers their backsides.

The NIC are good at advertising their Approved scheme. They send the Connections magazine plus stationary etc. to the pen pushers regularly, free of charge.

In the OP's situation, I would quote for the work and if I was chosen then have the conversation about NIC membership. It would be harder for them to turn you away if you've provided the most competitive price if it then means using someone more expensive.

 

[telectrix]

maybe napit need to hand out fatter brown envelopes. :38:

 

[Leesparkykent]

maybe napit need to hand out fatter brown envelopes. :38:

Or join the right golf course lol

 

[Welchyboy1]

I personally think they should get rid of all these other schemes and have one and thats it, like gas safe

then ratchet up the minimum entry requirements to approved contractor status only, no defined scope or domestic only installer

no 5 week courses, the JIB root of recognised competancy of approved electrician a minimum for any QS application

any unsupervised employees working, qualified to jib electrician grade minimum!

your either an electrician or your not, simple!

every one working on the same level playing field, the route to being qualified in black and white


that way its not loads of schemes having to lower standards to the bare minimum to compete with each other

when it was just the one NIC approved scheme they were something to be proud of attaining

maybe not perfect but a damn sight better than the joke situation we find ourselves in today

 

[the pict]

Have NAPITtake it up for you, insist they write to the person involved, dont let them fob you off, its what we pay them for,even if it does not go your way at least you got something for your £500 quid even of its only them getting off there backsides

 

[Diddy]

I thought about this very situation a while back and for the life of me I can't see why NAPIT don't try and take a few councils to court. The "may" have a case regarding open tendering for public funded contracts.......they certainly wont get anywhere unless they try....court cases could bring publicity to them too.