Radial to Ring

[rmaynard]

I need to put in 4 sockets in a shop, where the sockets are going is a 6mm radial from an old circuit, its on a 32a rcbo, can i pull this 6mm into a 4 pole isolator and run a ring out of it, iv looked through the regs and cant really find anything thats says i cant.

 

[Engineer54]

Totally Agree, these ring configurations were once very popular with councils, and even a on some of the private housing estates in the 60's...

I dare say there will be many here that haven't seen or come across them, (same as the so-called lollypop ring) and no doubt condemn them because they are not described in BS7671. But the truth is they Both conform with all the requirements of a final ring circuit....

 

[rich.250]

Where I used to work I was told to fail this type of cct
Alarently they were incorrectly wired. Which i looked into and didnt agree with,
Also told two different size cables cannot be terminated under the same termination screw....
I couldn't find anything in the regs to support this.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Where I used to work I was told to fail this type of cct
Alarently they were incorrectly wired. Which i looked into and didnt agree with,
Also told two different size cables cannot be terminated under the same termination screw....
I couldn't find anything in the regs to support this.

It can't be a failed can it Rich.

If you had 12 sockets say on the ground floor, and you have 12 JBs, each JB had a single cable going out to a socket, theoretically you have a single spur at each point on the ring, which as always been allowed, the only difference from convention is that instead of spurring off a socket your spurring a JB.

I suppose you could argue that your not spurring of a socket, but by spurring off a JB it must surely be safer, instead of double socket plus another double, 4 connection points, you will only ever have 2 points.

Yes the JBs could and likely were inaccessible, but the regs is never been retroactive and though I doubt you would wire a circuit like this now, in industrial situations I've seen and would still wire large rings like this, using tap off points.

As you say mate no reg against 2 different size conductors in one terminal as long as you conform to regs 526 and 526.1 in particular. Besides these rings were normally done in 2.5 or 7/029 and the spur the same size.

 

[rich.250]

That's my point malc. I didn't fail them, cos both lollipop rings and souring off to every socket are both fine.
I didn't see eye to eye at all with my old employer lol.
Just wanted a second opinion

 

[rich.250]

Spurring*

 

[adamh]

I cant remember the reg now but im sure it says something along the lines of an unfused spur for every s/o. I will check later but if thats the case you have now have no s/o on the ring main.

 

[Guest111]

A lot of council and miners mansion housing back in the 60's was wired similar to this.

You would have a ring running around, and at every socket point the ring would go into a JB and then a single cable out to the socket, it was felt you used less cable which I suppose you did, easier chasing in a single cable rather than 2 cables and easier connecting into a socket.

Always threw me at first, but got use to it

Ironic really saved cable but used more jb,s seen it a lot on old pit houses near me,last time I saw it was a few years ago when I went to do work on my mates house which he had bought a few years earlier,and had allegedly been rewired before he bought it turned out owner had just replaced socket fronts and leg to jb,leaving old rubber ring going back to cu boy was my mate peed off.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Adam your referring to appendix 15 I think ..................sorry lost the last bit.

 

[a1guvner]

We do the Lolipop on dental surgeries where they have a 20a dp isolator for the surgery isolation which we run the radial to then the ring out from there to the rest of the surgery

 

[QSGAZ]

just run a whole new ring back to the board, dont know why a radial is protected by a 32 amp any way.

 

[malcolmsanford]

just run a whole new ring back to the board, dont know why a radial is protected by a 32 amp any way.

Can I ask why you think an A2 radial is pointless

 

[rich.250]

Cos sockets are wired in 2.5mm malc.......
Hahahaha

 

[rmaynard]

Cos sockets are wired in 2.5mm malc.......
Hahahaha

not all, last ring i run was wired in 4mm

 

[rich.250]

not all, last ring i run was wired in 4mm

That was a joke, LOL.
2.5 is insufficient a lot of the time