UK Ring main or radial

[Reggie15071953]

I am moving to a bungalow which I imagine will need a rewire. I've spoken to a local electrician and when I was asking if there would be a ring main for the kitchen and another for the two bedrooms and lounge he told me that ring mains are old hat saying that radial circuits are preferred. For the lights he also said that having a radial live feed to each ceiling rose with a cable running to the switches is also old hat. He told me that the preferred option is to have a live feed to each switch with a neutral, earth, and switched live running to each ceiling rose. He said this makes life easier when wiring some light fittings i.e. not pendant lights and also made life easier if smart switches are added later. He also suggested a new consumer unit with rcbo's saying these are better but the cynic in me wonders if this is a means to squeeze more money out of me.

 

[mainline]

I am moving to a bungalow which I imagine will need a rewire. I've spoken to a local electrician and when I was asking if there would be a ring main for the kitchen and another for the two bedrooms and lounge he told me that ring mains are old hat saying that radial circuits are preferred. For the lights he also said that having a radial live feed to each ceiling rose with a cable running to the switches is also old hat. He told me that the preferred option is to have a live feed to each switch with a neutral, earth, and switched live running to each ceiling rose. He said this makes life easier when wiring some light fittings i.e. not pendant lights and also made life easier if smart switches are added later. He also suggested a new consumer unit with rcbo's saying these are better but the cynic in me wonders if this is a means to squeeze more money out of me.

Ring finals still have their place.
He's correct about the rest.

 

[littlespark]

It’s good practice to run individual radial circuits for appliances that take 2kW…. So washing machine, tumble dryer, etc.

I would still say a ring for a kitchen on its own. There’s a lot of things to be plugged in.

A 20A radial could suffice for bedrooms, as long as there’s no plug in heaters all over the place.

Rings are definitely not “old hat”… it’s just different ways of doing things.



For me, if I know exactly what’s being used, and I can calculate the total load… then I would use a radial…
But generally, it’s rings for domestic.

 

[vjsmarwick]

I know they spoke about wanting to change to radial circuits for safety as any fault shows up better as it leaves an open circuit rather than fed from both ends !
But I know I have always used rings for sockets radial for lights and loop the mains at the switches !
I don’t know what type of board you already have but the use of RCBO’s are a great idea but for a new board with all the mod cons these days are costly but if doing a rewire now would be the time !

 

[mickegh]

Electrician is correct on all 3 points imo

 

[mainline]

I know they spoke about wanting to change to radial circuits for safety as any fault shows up better as it leaves an open circuit rather than fed from both ends !

That’s true but it’s very unlikely to be in anyway dangerous as said they have their place.
It’s as already said going to depend on the needs of the install.

I prefer to run 2 radials instead for the kitchen sockets rather than a ring as it’s only the cost of the rcbo extra but gives better selectivity. I would recommend Dp rcbos which will give better isolation of the circuit especially where N to Earth faults are involved.

 

[vjsmarwick]

lol I like your answer but running two radial circuits instead would depend on how they are done and whether the spark knows what he’s doing !
I saw this done in a kitchen once and because of the design of the kitchen where the owners placed their items all the load was on one half of the kitchen overloading and tripping the one circuit where as the other circuit only ever had a hoover plugged in at the end of the kitchen as you came in the door !
In the mornings they would switch on the kettle to make tea a coffee maker because they liked real coffee toaster was also on. Needless to say 20A just didn’t do it. Not a problem I’ve ever had with a ring ! So each have their place in my own opinion.

 

[mainline]

lol I like your answer but running two radial circuits instead would depend on how they are done and whether the spark knows what he’s doing !
I saw this done in a kitchen once and because of the design of the kitchen where the owners placed their items all the load was on one half of the kitchen overloading and tripping the one circuit where as the other circuit only ever had a hoover plugged in at the end of the kitchen as you came in the door !
In the mornings they would switch on the kettle to make tea a coffee maker because they liked real coffee toaster was also on. Needless to say 20A just didn’t do it. Not a problem I’ve ever had with a ring ! So each have their place in my own opinion.

If that's a problem, you can leapfrog the sockets.

 

[brianmoooore]

lol I like your answer but running two radial circuits instead would depend on how they are done and whether the spark knows what he’s doing !
I saw this done in a kitchen once and because of the design of the kitchen where the owners placed their items all the load was on one half of the kitchen overloading and tripping the one circuit where as the other circuit only ever had a hoover plugged in at the end of the kitchen as you came in the door !
In the mornings they would switch on the kettle to make tea a coffee maker because they liked real coffee toaster was also on. Needless to say 20A just didn’t do it. Not a problem I’ve ever had with a ring ! So each have their place in my own opinion.

Joining the ends of the radials together to form a ring, and changing the circuit protection to a single 32A would solve the MCB overload problem, but it would still be a badly designed ring, with a good chance of overloading one leg.
Radial or ring, the design sparks still needs to know what he's doing.