stupid or cowboys

[glasgospark]

house visit today to quote for rewire lights on the basis the lights had no earth , already made my mind up 99.9% that there is a earth before i even step foot in house.
2 sparks before me said , defo needs rewired no earth

walked in light hanging from ceiling not secured i asked whats the prob customer replied no earth cable at lights , so i visualy tested it and seen all done in conduit ,
grabbed megger done Zs would you believe it a efli reading that was within the max allowed in reg book.

2 companys before never tested at all and said rewire needed 100%

guess im to honest

 

[Farmelectrics]

lack of knowledge for me probably just seen no seperate cpc and just said re wire required

 

[andyjthompson]

Lighting circuits were regularly installed back in the 60's with twin and earth with no integral earth, which doesn't present a problem until class 1 fittings are installed.... But as long as no class 1 fittings are installed, then we can only recommend to the customer. The regulations we work by are not retrospective and as such an install that was new in the 60's has to be viewed on the grounds of the regulations that were in place at that time and can not be deemed unsafe with a condition report. As instructed by local NICEIC inspector.

 

[Engineer54]

Another Mind reader hehe

This brings back some fond memories doesn't it!! lol!! :smiley2:

 

[DNS1]

twin and earth with no integral earth

If it's got no earth, how is it twin and earth?!

 

[andyjthompson]

lol ok you got me twin cable

 

[Engineer54]

What concerns me here is that and I quote Light hanging from celiling - worry that it was left like that.
Second and I take it you did a test at that point and that point only with a visual for the rest of circuit. I ask why was the end of line not found and a earth path proved and tested there?? before a judgement call is made??? as we all know there could be many breaks in the conduit corrosion plastic JB with no earth continuity a lose conduit downstream from where you tested which may result in high reading that do not comply and you may still not have a complete and healty earth path.
Just curious

Just because we have a earth present at a 1 point does not mean we have a earth

More likely, this is an embedded fully screwed conduit system, so no chance of any plastic JB's. lol
Agree in checking all points on this lighting installation, but the chances are, this conduit system will be good for many more years to come...

 

[andyjthompson]

Funny how habit had me write twin and earth better than some peoples habit of constantly informing a customer of an unsafe condition that doesn't really exist. Then to price for a job that doesn't really need doing. Honesty is the best policy tell them it doesn't have an earth, tell them the reasons why we now install circuits with earths, tell them that that as long as there is no class one fittings its OK and if there is they could be removed to class 2 rather than rewire.

 

[Billythekid]

lol ok you got me twin cable

Affectionately known as twin 'n' skin, although this now also means T+E :confused5:

 

[trev]

What concerns me here is that and I quote Light hanging from celiling - worry that it was left like that.
Second and I take it you did a test at that point and that point only with a visual for the rest of circuit. I ask why was the end of line not found and a earth path proved and tested there?? before a judgement call is made??? as we all know there could be many breaks in the conduit corrosion plastic JB with no earth continuity a lose conduit downstream from where you tested which may result in high reading that do not comply and you may still not have a complete and healty earth path.
Just curious

Just because we have a earth present at a 1 point does not mean we have a earth

You have a valid point but on the other hand he may have simply posted an abridged version in the hope of keeping our attention rather than posting I tested at the first light, then another, then another ......then when I found the highest reading of xx I realised this was the last point of utilisation

 

[trev]

Honesty is the best policy tell them it doesn't have an earth, tell them the reasons why we now install circuits with earths, tell them that that as long as there is no class one fittings its OK and if there is they could be removed to class 2 rather than rewire.

This had a perfectly good earth via the conduit.

 

[andyjthompson]

Was referring to the "professionals" that attended before first post who ether didn't understand that the conduit is a perfectly good earth or wanted to scam the customer.
Honesty is the best policy

 

[rmc86uk]

So the metal conduit is being used as the cpc. If metal fittings were used you would put a flying earth lead from conduit box earth terminal to fitting? Just clarifying as the original posts doesn't say if it is metal or plastic light fittings.

 

[andyjthompson]

You would hope that a earth tag has been made from metal conduit to metal fittings but I have seen many times the disregard for earthing class 1 fittings

 

[somersetsparks]

So the metal conduit is being used as the cpc. If metal fittings were used you would put a flying earth lead from conduit box earth terminal to fitting? Just clarifying as the original posts doesn't say if it is metal or plastic light fittings.

Yes best practise would always have a flying lead, however if I came accross it on an I&T as long as it had good continuity to fittings would just put it as c3.

 

[Guitarist]

Most likely they don't understand conduit systems and thought it easier just to opt for the rewire option. Just think how many electricians there must be out there now who have passed a short course, but have no experience at all of anything not covered in the classroom.