Two NICEIC installers failed to spot the lack of earth

[JosephandAmber]

Agent contacts me with an urgent request for a CU upgrade in Camden. They send over an EICR done the previous month and I have a quick skim. All seems pretty simple, CU needs an upgrade and some basic tidying of fixtures etc. Only 3 circuits so I'm not overly bothered about doing another EICR prior to doing the CU replacement.

Turn up to the property and within 10 mins I note there is no visible MET, nor is there any visible earth supply coming from the head. So I head inside and run some tests, again no earth. So I knock on the basement property and ask to test their installation, again no earth. Ok, so by this point I'm baffled by the lack of a main earth. So I called UKPN who send an engineer and he confirmed my fears, the property has never had an earth supply nor will they add one. As a result, he then issues all 4 flats with a Sec 26 ESQCR notice and turns off power to the entire building.

As you can imagine with 4 privately rented flats each with their own agents and landlords it kicks off. Turns out 2 of the 4 flats had EICRs completed within the past 3 months. One had a new CU installed. The property HAS NO EARTH!

Both EICRs were issued by NICEIC approved installers. Readings were recorded that could not have physically been taken. What is going on!?

 

[loz2754]

Fraud. Shocking how they get away with it.

 

[timhoward]

If they have been stupid enough to make up fake Ze readings, and they are legit CPS approved sparks, then I'd be writing a letter of complaint to the CPS. If you have the EICRs the contractors can be checked for membership online.
With UKPN's involvement it's an inarguable situation.
It makes my blood boil when people ostensibly vetted to the same level as me do things like this.

 

[JosephandAmber]

If they have been stupid enough to make up fake Ze readings, and they are legit CPS approved sparks, then I'd be writing a letter of complaint to the CPS. If you have the EICRs the contractors can be checked for membership online.
With UKPN's involvement it's an inarguable situation.
It makes my blood boil when people ostensibly vetted to the same level as me do things like this.

So I've just sent off a complaint to the NICEIC (they are listed as a domestic installer) concerning the EICR that was issued for the property I was working on. I've attached the EICR (Ze included) they issued and the UKPN notification that the property has no earth. I will update you when I get a response.

I am in the process of getting the details for the other property.

Btw NICEIC don't make it easy to complain, do they? Download and fill out a PDF that then has to be emailed to a specific address. Why not you know... just have an online complaints form?

 

[Mike Johnson]

What is preventing you making the system TT and allow the electricity to be turned back on for the benefit of the renters? It's what has to happen in the end anyway.

 

[JosephandAmber]

TT is exactly what they need to do, only I'm not getting involved as the politics of dealing with 4 landlords is too much faff for me.

 

[catdog1121]

Wow I hope those guys get chucked out of the cps but bet nothing happens, prob NICEIC will just say you need to complain direct to the contractors first, completely missing the point..

Bet you were popular when all the power got turned off..

 

[timhoward]

What is preventing you making the system TT and allow the electricity to be turned back on for the benefit of the renters? It's what has to happen in the end anyway.

Providing TT to flats can be a real pain. I would have expected UKPN to try and flog PME .

TT is exactly what they need to do, only I'm not getting involved as the politics of dealing with 4 landlords is too much faff for me.

Would you not at least sort the one you were originally changing a CU for?

 

[Mike Johnson]

TT is exactly what they need to do, only I'm not getting involved as the politics of dealing with 4 landlords is too much faff for me.

Only the same as dealing with four clients, and let's not forget getting paid four times.

Just looked up the Sec 26 Notice:

Who does the Esqcr Regulations 2002 apply to?
—(1) This regulation applies to distributors' low voltage networks in which the neutral and protective functions are combined.

Did you take a reading off the incoming sheath?

 

[cliffed]

Agent contacts me with an urgent request for a CU upgrade in Camden. They send over an EICR done the previous month and I have a quick skim. All seems pretty simple, CU needs an upgrade and some basic tidying of fixtures etc. Only 3 circuits so I'm not overly bothered about doing another EICR prior to doing the CU replacement.

Turn up to the property and within 10 mins I note there is no visible MET, nor is there any visible earth supply coming from the head. So I head inside and run some tests, again no earth. So I knock on the basement property and ask to test their installation, again no earth. Ok, so by this point I'm baffled by the lack of a main earth. So I called UKPN who send an engineer and he confirmed my fears, the property has never had an earth supply nor will they add one. As a result, he then issues all 4 flats with a Sec 26 ESQCR notice and turns off power to the entire building.

As you can imagine with 4 privately rented flats each with their own agents and landlords it kicks off. Turns out 2 of the 4 flats had EICRs completed within the past 3 months. One had a new CU installed. The property HAS NO EARTH!

Both EICRs were issued by NICEIC approved installers. Readings were recorded that could not have physically been taken. What is going on!?

That’s awful

 

[Dustydazzler]

Drive by EICR s

Easiest grand a day you will ever make

 

[Pretty Mouth]

It seems a bit of overkill to me, switching off the power to the whole building without notice, for a fault that has probably been there for decades. On the few occasions that I, or my clients, have reported defective earths, the DNO has been much more 'relaxed' in their response to it, usually dealing with it in a matter of weeks rather than days.

Were there any parallel paths via bonding etc?

 

[snowhead]

Drive by EICR s

Easiest grand a day you will ever make

So, we'll bring out Part P, that'll guarantee ALL installers are suitably qualified and the quality of installations improves over the subsequent years,,, FAIL

Next we'll bring out mandatory EICRs for Tennanted properties (possibly eventually leading to all properties just to make sure Part P is actually working) to absolutely guarantee that those properties are safe,, ANOTHER BIG FAIL.

What's next on the list, compulsory ENGTECH just make sure that EICRs are checking that Part P is working.??

 

[Dustydazzler]

It seems a bit of overkill to me, switching off the power to the whole building without notice, for a fault that has probably been there for decades. On the few occasions that I, or my clients, have reported defective earths, the DNO has been much more 'relaxed' in their response to it, usually dealing with it in a matter of weeks rather than days.

Were there any parallel paths via bonding etc?

I once waited 2 months for the DNO to come and sort out some old council flats that had no main earth to them.
These flats had been without any main earth for decades. The only bit of earth they were getting was from a bit of old 4mm twisted round the water pipe

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Now this will be an interesting thread to have updated @JosephandAmber
Do keep us posted. As soon as you get any updates you need to stop whatever you are doing, log on and update