Two rings in one room

[MFHEng]

don't have too much time to contribute, certainly not as much as we'd like, we may do some kind of faq based on popular posts in the future. Forums are difficult because of the short time you get to post and limited comunication to get your theory and point across.

 

[eskimo39]

Would it not be possible to move them both onto the same phase thus eliminating the 400v across phases?

 

[IQ Electrical]

don't have too much time to contribute, certainly not as much as we'd like, we may do some kind of faq based on popular posts in the future. Forums are difficult because of the short time you get to post and limited comunication to get your theory and point across.

But is it not the underlying point to help people rather than 'getting YOUR point across' ?

 

[accordfire]

don't have too much time to contribute, certainly not as much as we'd like, we may do some kind of faq based on popular posts in the future. Forums are difficult because of the short time you get to post and limited comunication to get your theory and point across.

"We"? Are you more than one of you then?

Surely, getting your point across is part of the art of writing in the first place??

Do you moderate the forums over on the IET at all?I know David doesn't get as much time on his own to do the moderating that seems to have been needed of late.

Perhaps, though - if the time was less spent in what amounts to personal attacks, and more on providing advice, guidance, and help that someone of your position should be able to provide, we would all benefit positively?

Just a thought, my £25 worth, you might say.

Yes, I am writing tongue in cheek to a degree.....

 

[MFHEng]

"We"? Are you more than one of you then?

Surely, getting your point across is part of the art of writing in the first place??

Do you moderate the forums over on the IET at all?I know David doesn't get as much time on his own to do the moderating that seems to have been needed of late.

Perhaps, though - if the time was less spent in what amounts to personal attacks, and more on providing advice, guidance, and help that someone of your position should be able to provide, we would all benefit positively?

Just a thought, my £25 worth, you might say.

Yes, I am writing tongue in cheek to a degree.....

Point taken, My apologies, would you like a receipt for your £25. We all have off days


The moderating has been the subject of some debate, it is not moderated heavily to promote free will and speach, it is however noted that it gets out of hand from time to time and we don't have time to spend on it at present

As for the underlying help rather than getting your point across, is'nt the point the help. I think "most"(tongue in cheeck) of my postshave been helpfull and not been damning in the way that I have seen others on many forums behave

 

[accordfire]

Point taken, My apologies, would you like a receipt for your £25. We all have off days


The moderating has been the subject of some debate, it is not moderated heavily to promote free will and speach, it is however noted that it gets out of hand from time to time and we don't have time to spend on it at present

As for the underlying help rather than getting your point across, is'nt the point the help. I think "most"(tongue in cheeck) of my postshave been helpfull and not been damning in the way that I have seen others on many forums behave

We do all have off days I guess. Apology accepted, and matter put to rest.

The point is to get the help across, and it's something I think is done rather well here - like you, better than most other forums I have been on or am on. In a short time I've found the guys on here to be the best of a lot of 'em out there, and the regular posters have big hearts and lots of help and care to offer.

And yes - your posts have been helpful too - the regs issues particularly are always good to have clarified, which I guess is really the point of the JELP/64/A committee?

The £25's better in your pocket, as I'm charging too much lol.

 

[MFHEng]

Thanks Bill, I'm in London today and need it for parking

 

[chris gray]

HI
You don't need to mark them the regulation is refering to fixed equipment and not socket outlets, at what point would you have two socket circuits dismantled at the same time? The sockets have the same nominal nominal voltage to earth of 230 volts. It is ambiguos and has been removed from AMD1. Just to clarify, you do not have to identify, with voltage labels ,sockets or note that they are fed from differing phases and therefore pose a 400 volt threat. You would label them normally stating there circuit and phase dsesignation but thats all.

weve just been snagged for this by the onsite EE,
scenario: potentially the monitor of a pc and the tower could be fed from seperate phases but on the same work station.

 

[MFHEng]

weve just been snagged for this by the onsite EE,
scenario: potentially the monitor of a pc and the tower could be fed from seperate phases but on the same work station.

The scenario is a possibility, however would not cause a problem as the conection between the 2 items would be a signal/data conection and carries no dangerous voltages or currents.

The onsite EE may be getting confused with outside broadcast and entertainment scenarios where there have been fatalities from players of electric guitars where different items of their kit and amplifiers/ mixing decks have had mixed phases introduced, which has unfavourable consequencies .

More prevelent when there is more than 1 generated supply and they are not in parralel. This means that mixed or same phases could come from diferent generators and be not in paralel, which can have serious implications


Roadies are or should be carefull not to mix phases in this type of equipment.(especially with multiple generated supplies on site

For more info look on the forums for someone within this type of field to give a better description but from your point of view, I don't see it as an issue for IT equipment. Even if it where a distance appart and labled, IT and office types would still stretch ex leads arround and ignore any labled warnings.

If your on site EE is still not playing ball email the IET help line with your query and you'll receive an answer to pass to him that may help your cause

 

[IQ Electrical]

weve just been snagged for this by the onsite EE,
scenario: potentially the monitor of a pc and the tower could be fed from seperate phases but on the same work station.

I think he's looking at the possibility of 2 items of equipment being in close proximity but being fed from different phases.
The danger would come from a live-earth fault on both items of class 1 equipment resulting in a line-line fault voltage of 400V.

What are the chances of both items of equipment developing such a fault without operating any protective devices?

It's another candidate for that 'myths' thread!

 

[MFHEng]

I agree, the likely hood would never make a realistic risk assesment, but his on site EE needs to be convinced , as he's the client and paying the invoices. I feel an article title coming on!! "myth busters" .

 

[darking]

the issue I have with this scenario is that someone may isolate one ring at one point, enter the room in question and open a socket believing it to be dead, and become dead himself

 

[Amp David]

the issue I have with this scenario is that someone may isolate one ring at one point, enter the room in question and open a socket believing it to be dead, and become dead himself

If they arn't checking doing a proper safe isolation, then they shouldn't be anywhere near to the socket!

We can't go on with the what if situations forever, we'd never get owt done

 

[IQ Electrical]

If they arn't checking doing a proper safe isolation, then they shouldn't be anywhere near to the socket!

We can't go on with the what if situations forever, we'd never get owt done

Absolutely agree, where do you stop?
If someone opens up a socket then they should be able to confirm isolation.

 

[darking]

We Still need to protect those who may switch off the breaker for one ring, test one socket in the room with a plug tester then treat all the sockets as dead. Remember you also might do a proper isolation on one board and not realise that some of the sockets are being fed by the installation next door. Nothing will show up on the board you have proven dead