Unqualified, inexperienced badged "electricians"

[highspark]

How can we put an end to this drivel? Why is there people out there unqualified and inexperienced bluffing their way into work. Taking work from fully qualified time served lads?Theres a couple in my area. Driving round in vans with schemes tatooed all over them. They look the biz - the outfit. But I know they are not electricians. They are chancers bluffing their way through. The 17th Edition minimum requirement to have a schemes backing...its a farce. The problem I have is the customers can't differenciate from a fully qualified. 17th edition, 2391, tech cert nvq3 electrician from a 17th edition short course idiot! It boils my blood

 

[Adam W]

well a-they dont want too,b-and they dont know...

There are a lot of customers who would like to know what kind of electrician they are employing, many of whom would rather employ a fully qualified one than one who's done a 5 week 'crash course'.
At one point nobody had heard of Part P, but now the likes of Matt Alright BBC Rogue Traders and that Dominic Littlewood keep telling everyone about it so the message is getting through; what I'm saying is the same could be done with a JIB card - remember the card lists your qualifications and the JIB don't give out cards like sweets.

 

[alarm man]

"That's not any old electrician, that's a M&S electrician.

i so wanted to post that....:smartass:

 

[Adam W]

Whilst I understand where a lot of the anti-Electrical Trainee rants are coming from, I think it's a little unfair to tar everyone with the same brush, just because they've not done a full JIB apprenticeship.

People keep talking about the importance of being able to do the non-electrical side of the domestic business (jemmying boards, drilling joists/brickwork etc) but there are many ways to learn these skills.

If someone has spent 10 years as a builder, plumber etc, they're already going to know their way around the tools. In that instance, a domestic installer course and a lot of time with the books would likely be enough for them to go into a customers house and do domestic work. Why should they be prevented from this because they've not got a JIB card?

I'm going down the domestic installer route into the industry myself. I've got yonks of experience with domestic building work, plastering, plumbing etc and an engineering background.

It's about proving it though. Someone with 10 years building experience might be good at lifting floorboards and filling in chases, but someone thinking they know it all is no reason to lower the bar. We get a lot of people coming on here thinking they're automatically an electrician because they've worked in IT for 20 years, but it doesn't work like that - they still have to take the exams and do their portfolio the same as everyone else. While some may excel at it, perhaps because they've had practice on their own home, some will realise that in fact they don't know it all, and it's better to find that out in a college than when you've gone out to represent the industry in a customer's house.

 

[BillyH]

Umm.. no sarcasm intended but is that not the JIB gold card..?

There's plenty of guys on here with City and Guilds parts 1 and 2 (or A and B if you're an oldie like me)who would struggle to get a gold card.Don't make you a better sparky though.

 

[alarm man]

There's plenty of guys on here with City and Guilds parts 1 and 2 (or A and B if you're an oldie like me)who would struggle to get a gold card.Don't make you a better sparky though.

would you not qualify for a gold card under the jib grandfather rights scheme

 

[Marvo]

I may be starting to understand the new system that has appeared in the electrical industry.....

I'm glad you're understanding it UNG, I've been hanging around this forum for quite a while and I'm as confused now as the day I arrived. I honestly don't understand how Part P which as I keep reading is a building regulation of some sort is touted as an electrical qualification.

To me the whole UK qualification system reminds me of calculus. I sat through weeks of it in class and it all went over my head, I was getting despondent and depressed at not understanding, then one day, for no particular reason the fog just cleared and it all made perfect sense. With the part p thing though the fog is being persistent still and showing no signs of clearing just yet.

 

[Guest112]

i dont think this fogs going to clear tbh

 

[ipf]

i dont think this fogs going to clear tbh

A real Peeeeeeeeee...souper!!! lol!

 

[trev]

I'm glad you're understanding it UNG, I've been hanging around this forum for quite a while and I'm as confused now as the day I arrived. I honestly don't understand how Part P which as I keep reading is a building regulation of some sort is touted as an electrical qualification

There's a qualification called the EAL Domestic Installer's Certificate which purports to teach people the standards and expectations of the building reg Part P. Idiots then decided to tell people they were part p qualified and the whole thing mushroomed from there Marvo. Fact of the matter is the qual is pretty much worthless to a proper spark.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

I'm glad you're understanding it UNG, I've been hanging around this forum for quite a while and I'm as confused now as the day I arrived. I honestly don't understand how Part P which as I keep reading is a building regulation of some sort is touted as an electrical qualification.

To me the whole UK qualification system reminds me of calculus. I sat through weeks of it in class and it all went over my head, I was getting despondent and depressed at not understanding, then one day, for no particular reason the fog just cleared and it all made perfect sense. With the part p thing though the fog is being persistent still and showing no signs of clearing just yet.

...although both show a likelihood of tending towards infinity !

 

[Engineer54]

There's a qualification called the EAL Domestic Installer's Certificate which purports to teach people the standards and expectations of the building reg Part P. Idiots then decided to tell people they were part p qualified and the whole thing mushroomed from there Marvo. Fact of the matter is the qual is pretty much worthless to a proper spark.

But NOT worthless to these training centres, who probably charge a couple of hundred quid for that bit of worthless paper... lol!!

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Did anyone get my calculus joke? Never attempted one before.

 

[wattsy]

I know what you all mean about incompetent unqualified people being a danger, but i'm a "Domestic Installer" and i've worked alongside a number of "Fully Qualified" electricians and some of their work is shocking (no pun intended). Some don't even bother to test and just make the results up. On one job that I was helping out a fully qualified electrician finish wiring a new annex, they weren't even going to test before energising the new installation, I insisted that some tests should be done only to find out there was no earth on the house or the new annex!

My point is, just because someone is "fully qualified" it doesn't necessarily mean they are going to do a better job than a Domestic Installer.

 

[highspark]

I know what you all mean about incompetent unqualified people being a danger, but i'm a "Domestic Installer" and i've worked alongside a number of "Fully Qualified" electricians and some of their work is shocking (no pun intended). Some don't even bother to test and just make the results up. On one job that I was helping out a fully qualified electrician finish wiring a new annex, they weren't even going to test before energising the new installation, I insisted that some tests should be done only to find out there was no earth on the house or the new annex! My point is, just because someone is "fully qualified" it doesn't necessarily mean they are going to do a better job than a Domestic Installer.

A domestic installer is a chancer though. He/she isn't experienced enough to have the name "ELECTRICIAN" branded across their vans. The problem I am talking about is that customers cannot differenciate between fully qualified and a chancer and all domestic Electrical Trainee are chancers! My wholesaler told me someone came in and asked for a 5.5mm earth....to which he said what for? The nearest we do is 6mm...but why do you need it. He said for the main earth. He said what? Chancer said well I've just done the adiabetic equation and I need a 5.5mm....Wholesaler said well what size is your bonding...to which he said 10mm....he was the laughing stock of the shop and the wholesaler was telling everyone. Inexperience, not a clue rubbish from someone trying to make people think he knows what he is doing. The blokes driving round in a sign written van with a scheme splashed all over it...incompetent twerp isn't the word. The same bloke was putting 4mm twin and earth radials in a house about 25m2.....just following the regs!

 

[needasparks]

Perhaps the DI's should have a green ''L'' plate. It works for new drivers.