What inspection and test should be done when replacing a consumer unit.

[bearlyable]

Im currently looking to be to joining and thus being assessed by a registered body e.g. N.I.C.E.I.C as a 'domestic installer'
I intend to replace my Consumer Unit in my home as one of the assessment example but having spoken with building control and realising using their words not mine 'they haven't got their act together so therefore they don't know'
Can any one please offer advise as to what tests and certificates need to be completed to gain such an accreditation from a registered body and do the test results need to be recorded on the certificates of that body?
It seems to be there are some grey, deep voids to cross to gain the required standards, it seems the chaps at the top seem to have forgotten the lemonade on this picnic???
That aside any assistance with this will gratefully be accepted.

 

[Guest123]

Hi there.

If you repalce a consumer unit you need to test the whole of the installation and issue an Electrical Installation Certificate.

You can use any generic test certificates i.e the ones in BS 7671, NICEIC green ones etc. As long as you certify your work thats fine.

You will also have to notify LABC before you do the work as they will want to come out and inspect before after and during and relieve you of around £100 - £250 for the pleasure.

Cheers

 

[bearlyable]

Firstly thank you very much for your speedy concise response with regards to the LABC ..I do understand this and though I don't expect anyone to condone my method having contacted both the LABC and a Registered Body it seems to me that one doesn't seem to know what the other should, would or could do to make the situation clear with this in mind I intend to carry out the work and all being well submitting it through the registered body retrospectivily...
Just to give you a idea of the merkyness of the two bodys that can't find their torso's

I do not hold 2391 therefore as far as the LABC is concerned I need to be part of a Reg. Body to carry out the work ..... To become part of a Reg. Body I need to do the work, to be assessed.. It seems to me that I have only two real solutions
1. Gain 2391
2. Jump across the void.

With regards to '1'
I fully intend to gain 2391 but having read this forum and other articles I believe getting some good experience of inspecting and testing before going for the qualification is essential.

Therefore to achive that I must go for 2

Your thought are welcome..!

 

[baldsparkies]

Hi there.


You will also have to notify LABC before you do the work as they will want to come out and inspect before after and during and relieve you of around £100 - £250 for the pleasure.

Cheers

Not neccassarily Lenny,

I can remember using a board change myself prior to assesment and building control told me change the board near your assesment date, If you pass sign the work off through the competant persons scheme if not go through building control within 30 days. I passed so no £100-£250 pleasure trip to worry about.
They are hot on your Installation certificate for the job regardless, they said it is documented evidence that due dilligance, good electrical practice and a level of competance has been shown.
(Would go along with that).

 

[bearlyable]

Brilliant
Thats exactly the reassuring info I wanted.
I know not all LABC are the same but you've just nailed it for me If one does it why can't all... Thanks once again for your help I feel a little more easy..

 

[baldsparkies]

Firstly thank you very much for your speedy concise response with regards to the LABC ..I do understand this and though I don't expect anyone to condone my method having contacted both the LABC and a Registered Body it seems to me that one doesn't seem to know what the other should, would or could do to make the situation clear with this in mind I intend to carry out the work and all being well submitting it through the registered body retrospectivily...
Just to give you a idea of the merkyness of the two bodys that can't find their torso's

I do not hold 2391 therefore as far as the LABC is concerned I need to be part of a Reg. Body to carry out the work ..... To become part of a Reg. Body I need to do the work, to be assessed.. It seems to me that I have only two real solutions
1. Gain 2391
2. Jump across the void.

With regards to '1'
I fully intend to gain 2391 but having read this forum and other articles I believe getting some good experience of inspecting and testing before going for the qualification is essential.

Therefore to achive that I must go for 2

Your thought are welcome..!

Bearlyable,
The 2391 is indeed worth passing and well recognised,however when you are assesed you will be asked to complete certain inspection and testing procedures to satisfy the assesor that you can (in this instance) report on your own work/installations. This will cover your Installation certificates, The 2391 along with experiance and to be fair the 2391 is aimed at experianced electricians. Shows a level of competance to progress to say a periodic inspection which takes you to another level, because now you are reporting on the condition and compliance of older installations which bring in far more complicating factors,hope this helps.

 

[trebor]

Firstly thank you very much for your speedy concise response with regards to the LABC ..I do understand this and though I don't expect anyone to condone my method having contacted both the LABC and a Registered Body it seems to me that one doesn't seem to know what the other should, would or could do to make the situation clear with this in mind I intend to carry out the work and all being well submitting it through the registered body retrospectivily...
Just to give you a idea of the merkyness of the two bodys that can't find their torso's

I do not hold 2391 therefore as far as the LABC is concerned I need to be part of a Reg. Body to carry out the work ..... To become part of a Reg. Body I need to do the work, to be assessed.. It seems to me that I have only two real solutions
1. Gain 2391
2. Jump across the void.

With regards to '1'
I fully intend to gain 2391 but having read this forum and other articles I believe getting some good experience of inspecting and testing before going for the qualification is essential.

Therefore to achive that I must go for 2

Your thought are welcome..!

Dont forget if you are only looking to verify your own work and gain accreditation of the Part P scheme you have the option of 2392 which is a stepping stone to 2391, 2392 is a multiple choice closed book exam and together with the 17th edition is adequate for scheme membership, say domestic installer for example, this then will enable you to build a porfolio of work whilst preparing for the 2391

 

[ezzzekiel]

not sure if I have read post correctly, or what level experience you have, but a full set of electrical tests are required and electrical installation certificate issued (using the correct test equipment obviously)
although the tests are quite simple to carry out the technical questions that the assesor will ask can get deep especially if he suspects you are winging it.

 

[baldsparkies]

not sure if I have read post correctly, or what level experience you have, but a full set of electrical tests are required and electrical installation certificate issued (using the correct test equipment obviously)
although the tests are quite simple to carry out the technical questions that the assesor will ask can get deep especially if he suspects you are winging it.

I have a mate who was bricking it big time on his first assesment, good sparks but not so good on the theory. I suggested guidance note 3 as a good read and he found it very usefull (faced the assesor with a lot more confidence) The bottom line is you need to do some homework on the inspection and testing to prove you have a working knowledge of what your doing,but then,thats the whole point of the assesment. I have never felt that these guys ever go any deeper than they need to, and are a good bunch who are not out to catch you out. Over the years I have met them many times, especially when I was working for a big company as the qualifying supervisor and never came across what I would consider a bad one.Dont be afraid to ask questions, make sure you read up on testing procedures and what your results mean, make sure you have the paperwork they ask for and a decent set of testers, and your good to go. (Dont forget the tea and biscuits)

 

[kung]

Having the 2391 isnt needed for assessment for domestic installer ! The LABC in wokingham and all 14 area's ive spoke to say its a big headache and pain for them they would sooner people just miss them out if their doing a job for assessment as if you pass you sign off the job and even if you fail as said you can then go through LABC etc.
Its a big con ! if your not being assessed i can understand going through LABC but if for assessment your being ripped off ! by the time you've paid LABC & GOV BODY thats about £600 ! all part of if you need it they will rip you off ! i have heard a few people who still pass even with not notifying LABC the assessor just marks you down for a non compliance but wont fail you on that ! Will be intresting to find out !
Regards
Kung.

 

[markythesparky]

Just to clarify, Someone has posted a reply stating that you should test the whole instalation and issue a completion cert.

You need to test the whole installation to assess whether it is suitable for a fuseboard change (with RCDs etc). this is done with a periodic inspection and report sheet. if you issue a completion cert you are saying that you have done all the wiring in the house and that is complies with BS7671.

If the installation holds up to use with a modern fuseboard then change it and issue a completion cert stating clearly that you are certificating only the fuseboard change. this then covers you for circuit assessment and also the requirements of BS7671.

Most regulatory bodies state that Part P compliance certs should be issued within 25 days of the job having been completed. this woul stand up with what baldsparkies is saying.

hope this helps

markythesparky

 

[Guest123]

if you issue a completion cert you are saying that you have done all the wiring in the house and that is complies with BS7671.

This is not so, as in the extent of installation covered box you would note "upgrading of CU only" thereby limiting the scope of the work to replacing the CU and nothing else.

 

[markythesparky]

ok point taken. the reason that i mentioned it is because we carried out a PIR on an industrial premises and changed the 5no dist boards with in the installation. we issued EIC for these which included all the circuit details and test results and we also stated that it was the dist board change that we had carried out.

We then had an NICEIC insoection on it and were told not to do it again as we were in effect certificating the whole installation. he told us to issue PIR for the circuits and then an EIC for the work carried out.

trouble is, wvery inspector you see has s different point of view.

No offence meant.

 

[Guest123]

None taken.

So your NICCY man says that when you've replaced a CU, you need to compile 2 test certs, is this right?? 1. An EIC for the CU upgrade and 2. A PIR for all the outgoing circuits.

That sounds ridiculous to me, the only test results you would have on the EIC would be the Ze and PFC, unless it was on a sub-main. With all ougoing circuits results on the PIR along with the Ze and PFC again.

What are the NIC thinking with this one.

 

[markythesparky]

You got it. and yes that correct tht the only results you woud have are those you mention. complete waste of the cert. but then what do the NIC care? you have buy them from the NIC when you run out anyway.

Unbelievable init!