EU Brexit - How will you vote given the latest "news"

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

is heath still alive? can he be shot for treason? bugger, he's dead. let's shoot blair instead.

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Are we actually legitimately in the EU or was we cheated into joining, here is how we actually ended up in the EU and who IMHO commited an act of treason and breach the very rights of the electorate by signing us up. Here's a snippet about what happened when we apparently joined the EU.

Many constitutional experts believe that Britain isn’t actually a member of the European Union since our apparent entry was in violation of British law and was, therefore invalid.
In enacting the European Communities Bill through an ordinary vote in the House of Commons, Ted Heath’s Government breached the constitutional convention which requires a prior consultation of the people (either by a general election or a referendum) on any measure involving constitutional change. The general election or referendum must take place before any related parliamentary debate. (Britain has no straightforward written constitution. But, the signing of the Common Market entrance documents was, without a doubt, a breach of the spirit of our constitution.)

Just weeks before the 1970 general election which made him Prime Minister, Edward Heath declared that it would be wrong if any Government contemplating membership of the European Community were to take this step without `the full hearted consent of Parliament and people’.
However, when it came to it Heath didn’t have a referendum because opinion polls at the time (1972) showed that the British people were hugely opposed (by a margin of two to one) against joining the Common Market. Instead, Heath merely signed the documents that took us into what became the European Union on the basis that Parliament alone had passed the European Communities Bill of 1972.

You should have provide a citation for that quote, and not one you get a medal for

Pete's done thread on 1962, well I sure have some memories for 1972!

 

[Darkwood]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

You should have provide a citation for that quote, and not one you get a medal for

Pete's done thread on 1962, well I sure have some memories for 1972!

Here's the source, it a piece by Vernon Coleman, a renowned Author, Journalist etc who's one of many interests is politics.. the full piece makes for very interesting reading and hints at bribary as a key factor but in a speculative sense but it created a very big stir at the time and the goverment went tight lipped and wouldn't answer to the claims, since then it has been confirmed on numerous occasions by those in his party that this was the case indeed and he broke the law to get us into the EU.
Was Britain Taken Into The EU Illegally?

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

if that's the case, can we have all them billions back and deport terrorists?

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I note people have mentioned Ted heath, Margaret Thatcher and Hitler in this thread. The first two did more damage than the latter managed to this country.

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

and all three added together topped by blair and brown.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Countries messed up anyway. Being run by Angela and now weve got an Islamist lord Mayor of London. Might as well turn the lights off soon, mind you we get what we ask for..........

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I note people have mentioned Ted heath, Margaret Thatcher and Hitler in this thread. The first two did more damage than the latter managed to this country.

Oh dear, someone's letting their romantics getting in the way of reality. You do no homage to the people of this country, who lay down their lives to defeat the Nazis. I hope you choose to retract that remark.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

It's nothing to do with romantics. The people who have let them down are the politicians, of all colours (predominantly blue IMO), who have run this country into the ground for the last 50 odd years. If those that fought come back and see the shambles that this country is becoming I dare say a good many would wonder why they bothered. Now we've got Cameron "dictating" to us and telling us what we should do. I know only too well of the sacrifice people made, my father fought in Burma, my point is that they are being let down big time by the dross that runs this country.

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

It's nothing to do with romantics. The people who have let them down are the politicians, of all colours (predominantly blue IMO)............I know only too well of the sacrifice people made, my father fought in Burma,

Then you should know, not to compare democratically elected & tenured politicians of this country (of whatever political persuasion) and Hitler.

Every five years in this country, if we don't like what our government are dong, we can vote them out. It took a world war to rid us of him.

Democracy, it's what this thread is all about.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Then you should know, not to compare democratically elected & tenured politicians of this country (of whatever political persuasion) and Hitler.

Every five years in this country, if we don't like what our government are dong, we can vote them out. It took a world war to rid us of him.

Democracy, it's what this thread is all about.

I think you have misunderstood my point. I wasn't "comparing them" on that basis, Hitler was obviously an evil nutter, no different from some modern day (late thankfully) examples. I was suggesting that the other two also, IMO, managed to do irreparable damage to our country. In fact, just thinking about it, we did manage to recover very well from the war, and then our politicians began to sell off the country and generally get us in the mess we are now. and speaking of democracy, that's alive and kicking is it? Here we have the majority of Tory MP's probably wanting to leave the EU, and Cameron DICTATING to us all to leave. These remain commentators will be blaming any future bad weather on staying in soon the laughable way they are trying to sway us.

 

[andyb]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Here we have the majority of Tory MP's probably wanting to leave the EU, and Cameron DICTATING to us all to leave. These remain commentators will be blaming any future bad weather on staying in soon the laughable way they are trying to sway us.

That doesn't make a lot of sense to me Sparks.

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I think you have misunderstood my point. I wasn't "comparing them" on that basis, Hitler was obviously an evil nutter, no different from some modern day (late thankfully) examples. I was suggesting that the other two also, IMO, managed to do irreparable damage to our country. In fact, just thinking about it, we did manage to recover very well from the war, and then our politicians began to sell off the country and generally get us in the mess we are now. and speaking of democracy, that's alive and kicking is it? Here we have the majority of Tory MP's probably wanting to leave the EU, and Cameron DICTATING to us all to STAY IN. These remain commentators will be blaming any future bad weather on staying in soon the laughable way they are trying to sway us.

corrected that for you.you owe me a pint. :75:

 

[UNG]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Countries fooked anyway. Being run by Angela and now weve got an Islamist lord Mayor of London. Might as well turn the lights off soon, mind you we get what we ask for..........

He isn't lord mayor he is just the Mayor of London, the Lord Mayor is the leader of the City of London Corporation and is completely different

 

[andyb]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Countries messed up anyway. Being run by Angela and now weve got an Islamist lord Mayor of London. Might as well turn the lights off soon, mind you we get what we ask for..........

Countries not messed up,
Not run by Angele Merkel
Mayor not Lord Mayor
And he's not an Islamist.

Any other untruths you'd like to use to make your point.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Any other untruths you'd like to use to make your point.

Countries not messed up, Yes it is
Not run by Angele Merkel Almost, might as well be. Germans have got control in the end without firing a shot
Mayor not Lord Mayor You know what I meant
And he's not an Islamist. He's not a Muslim then? I think you will find he is, and as such will subscribe to the same theme, that they are the superior religion and every other religion (or those with no faith like me) are somehow inferior.

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

..... I think you will find he is, and as such will subscribe to the same theme, that they are the superior religion and every other religion (or those with no faith like me) are somehow inferior.

haha.... this jus makes you sound like a thicko.....

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

haha.... this jus makes you sound like a thicko.....

Why's that then spoony?

 

[Darkwood]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Countries not messed up, Yes it is
Not run by Angele Merkel Almost, might as well be. Germans have got control in the end without firing a shot
Mayor not Lord Mayor You know what I meant
And he's not an Islamist. He's not a Muslim then? I think you will find he is, and as such will subscribe to the same theme, that they are the superior religion and every other religion (or those with no faith like me) are somehow inferior.

I have muslim friends who do not fit your stereotype here, if you are to argue what the Quran says then you can see almost identical scripture in the bible yet I don't see those with a far right attitude making similar accusations and painting all christians with the same brush, yes amongst the muslim faith there is a sector that read and interpret the Quran exactly as you have expressed but to tar everyone with the same brush with that statement is somewhat dangerous and why we have groups like EDL and Britain First (Britain First could be labled as Christian Fanatics by the same thinking) who have many times been seen to spout racist, xenophobic crap, yes there may be an underlying issue that needs addressing but resorting to hatred and stigmatisation on mass means you end up no better than the fanatics you are painting the whole muslim faith to be.
Most religions believe their own God to be the greatest hence they follow their particular faith, they will instinctively look at any other beliefs, God's etc as not the truth or mis-guided so put their own beliefs on somewhat of a pedestal, if you ever try convince a jehovah witness that God doesn't exist you will see what I mean as they debunk your thinking and believe you haven't yet found your way, so in respect to start saying someone of a muslim faith believes their God is either the only God or the Greatest is not unique to the muslim faith, it just appears more prominent because we have extremists and fanatics spreading hatred as oppose to respect for other beliefs.

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Why's that then spoony?

Please ready post #339. Pretty much sums it up......

Ta darkwood.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I have muslim friends who do not fit your stereotype here, if you are to argue what the Quran says then you can see almost identical scripture in the bible yet I don't see those with a far right attitude making similar accusations and painting all christians with the same brush, yes amongst the muslim faith there is a sector that read and interpret the Quran exactly as you have expressed but to tar everyone with the same brush with that statement is somewhat dangerous and why we have groups like EDL and Britain First (Britain First could be labled as Christian Fanatics by the same thinking) who have many times been seen to spout racist, xenophobic crap, yes there may be an underlying issue that needs addressing but resorting to hatred and stigmatisation on mass means you end up no better than the fanatics you are painting the whole muslim faith to be.
Most religions believe their own God to be the greatest hence they follow their particular faith, they will instinctively look at any other beliefs, God's etc as not the truth or mis-guided so put their own beliefs on somewhat of a pedestal, if you ever try convince a jehovah witness that God doesn't exist you will see what I mean as they debunk your thinking and believe you haven't yet found your way, so in respect to start saying someone of a muslim faith believes their God is either the only God or the Greatest is not unique to the muslim faith, it just appears more prominent because we have extremists and fanatics spreading hatred as oppose to respect for other beliefs.

I agree to an extent with what you say DW, I was not implying that it is only the Muslim faith that has deep rooted prejudice inherent in its beliefs, as you say all other religions display similarities to a lesser degree. However you cannot get away from the fact that Muslims are taught from an early age that they are the superior religion and that no other, including non-belief, should be tolerated. Until the world is rid of all religious nonsense then there will never be peace, but that day will be a long time coming. Let us see how vocal our new Mayor is the next time some crazed lunatics blow up another load of innocent people, because in my opinion the Muslim leaders are woefully inadequate when it comes to public and continued condemnation of violence perpetrated in the name of Allah.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Please ready post #339. Pretty much sums it up......

Ta darkwood.

Can't you make up your own response, or are you a bit too thick?

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Can't you make up your own response, or are you a bit too thick?

I love you too. Come here and give us a big hug. You know you want to...

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Until the world is rid of all religious nonsense then there will never be peace, but that day will be a long time coming.

Couldn't agree with this more.

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I agree to an extent with what you say DW, I was not implying that it is only the Muslim faith that has deep rooted prejudice inherent in its beliefs, as you say all other religions display similarities to a lesser degree. However you cannot get away from the fact that Muslims are taught from an early age that they are the superior religion and that no other, including non-belief, should be tolerated. Until the world is rid of all religious nonsense then there will never be peace, but that day will be a long time coming. Let us see how vocal our new Mayor is the next time some crazed lunatics blow up another load of innocent people, because in my opinion the Muslim leaders are woefully inadequate when it comes to public and continued condemnation of violence perpetrated in the name of Allah.

The people who blow up others are not Muslims. True Muslims believe in piece. As above, all religions think there's is superior. Just get one person of one faith trying to marry someone of another faith and see which faith will approve the wedding.

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Just get one person of one faith trying to marry someone of another faith and see which faith will approve the wedding.


:shades_smile:druids would approve, ask des.:smilielol5:

 

[UNG]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

The people who blow up others are not Muslims. True Muslims believe in piece. As above, all religions think there's is superior. Just get one person of one faith trying to marry someone of another faith and see which faith will approve the wedding.

There are a lot do believe in piece or pieces but it is normally those doing the killing

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I always thought I was illiterate. Peace.....
Anyway, I think that this may be going off topic a bit now. Happy to carry this on if someone want to start another thread.

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

I always thought I was illiterate. Peace.....
Anyway, I think that this may be going off topic a bit now. Happy to carry this on if someone want to start another thread.

I dunno, the thread in essence is about democracy, the belief in freedom and equality. Can't agree with all sparksburnout says, be he has a point about Islam. The Quran does tell Muslims how to think about unbelievers and how to deal with them. Some take it more literal than others.

 

[Spoon]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

And I thought that this thread was about 'Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"'.
And the bible is better....... I'm going to burn in hell for eternity cause I don't believe in someone.... Nice god eh....

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

And I thought that this thread was about 'Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"'.
And the bible is better....... I'm going to burn in hell for eternity cause I don't believe in someone.... Nice god eh....

You right to call a halt........we could go on for ages about this, and it's been debated at length before.

See Gordon Brown suddenly appeared after 6 years in the wilderness!

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

You right to call a halt........we could go on for ages about this, and it's been debated at length before.

See Gordon Brown suddenly appeared after 6 years in the wilderness!

wonder if gordon is keeping an eye on the forum. :smilielol5:

 

[Midwest]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

wonder if gordon is keeping an eye on the forum. :smilielol5:

Don't see him and Sturgeon in the same room, do ya!

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Look I can't stand this any-more I've got my Stroma assessment tomorrow and I still have not got a lock off device that I can fit before I take the CU cover off.

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Or a copy of the BYB. God help me. Oooops

 

[Octopus]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

See Gordon Brown suddenly appeared after 6 years in the wilderness!

Can't see that muppet influencing too many people!

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Can't see that muppet influencing too many people!

Gordon was supposedly one of the best financial brains we ever had.

 

[telectrix]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Gordon was supposedly one of the best financial brains we ever had.

and the earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese.

 

[Octopus]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Gordon was supposedly one of the best financial brains we ever had.

Yup - I remember him "the end to boom and bust" was his claim - until the bust of 2008. Pillock.

He sold off gold at rock bottom prices, committed our grand children to countless billions of PFI instead of have debt on the national "books" and was warned by the treasury in 2005 that tax receipts were not keeping up with spending commitments...

 

[sparksburnout]

Re: EU - How will you vote given the latest "news"

Anyone know where I can get one of these miniature lock off things??