AFDD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Toneyz · Feb 13, 2019

Sorry I don't know how to post up a youtube link but have a look at the John Ward one part 2 on AFDD's worth a watch.

Gavin John Hyde · Feb 13, 2019

Saw it earlier. Makes you wonder if they are any good?
Its the downside to letting commercial interests get on the jpel/64 and influence regs. The companies that make them have seen £ signs galore with these.

Toneyz · Feb 13, 2019

Thanks, Gavin for posting it up.

PEG · Feb 14, 2019

These devices are starting to look like that bomb detector,the dude had the military over with....i think he drew 6 figures,before they looked inside it...and locked him up

McCormick was his name,got ten years....maybe he's serving it at Eaton's R&D division?

Loki · Feb 14, 2019

It doesn't look like that Eton AFDD is fit for purpose after seeing that video.
Would like to see Etons response.

Bobster · Feb 14, 2019

Without any way to test the functionality of an AFDD on site correctly (outside of a lab), they have been introduced far too early.

Considering the price of them not being cheap. How are you going to explain the only way you can check if one is faulty is replacing it.

(An actual solution described in the troubleshooting of one manufacturer.)

They've been around for a while in the US now and cause nothing but bother. Fridge compressor starting causes tiny arc in contacts (something it's designed to handle) ooops half the house is now without power. An there is no test you can do to prove anything is ok.

Shoei · Feb 14, 2019

AFDDs are a response to an American problem, 30k housefires a year caused by high-current radials in wooden buildings, and what we would call substandard wiring - lots of wire nuts, for example.

A feature of RFCs is they don't arc if there's a single break, a safety factor that AFDD makers want us to abandon, just so the AFDD can detect an arc if a break happens. In other words, increase the chances of a dangerous fault just so an AFDD can detect it.

Sparks are supposed to recommend AFDDs and note if the customer declines. How is the customer meant to make that technical judgement?

Pete999 · Feb 14, 2019

Shoei said:
AFDDs are a response to an American problem, 30k housefires a year caused by high-current radials in wooden buildings, and what we would call substandard wiring - lots of wire nuts, for example.

A feature of RFCs is they don't arc if there's a single break, a safety factor that AFDD makers want us to abandon, just so the AFDD can detect an arc if a break happens. In other words, increase the chances of a dangerous fault just so an AFDD can detect it.

Sparks are supposed to recommend AFDDs and note if the customer declines. How is the customer meant to make that technical judgement?

Good point Mate, but with some of the prices of AFDDs being bandied about, I think the decision not to use them will be a financial choice.

sparksburnout · Feb 14, 2019

Ha! That's a brilliant video - there's nothing in that bloody great big thing apart from a green LED. How big a CU are we supposed to need to get a few of them in? Half the places you find them installed in won't have enough room. Nice one IET, when are the £1K testers coming on sale, mind you they should be pretty simple things to test the innards of that pile of junk.

Taylortwocities · Feb 14, 2019

Part 1 of JW's discussion is here

Wilko · Feb 14, 2019

Always worth a watch is JW

.
It doesn't seem right for IET to put these in the requirements without bags of research and testing to validate them. Perhaps I missed that step in their process ? (Warning - sarcasm likely)

sparksburnout · Feb 14, 2019

Eaton are not the only one's not fit for purpose.

Pete999 · Feb 14, 2019

Gavin John Hyde said:
Saw it earlier. Makes you wonder if they are any good?
Its the downside to letting commercial interests get on the jpel/64 and influence regs. The companies that make them have seen £ signs galore with these.

A pretty damming example of how these AFDDs aren't all they are made out to be, it was a low load, but how much will it take to start a fire?????? good video JW

Gavin John Hyde · Feb 14, 2019

this guy got an afdd to trip. not sure how realistic his experiment is though. the video from 12mins onwards shows the experiment, so skip the waffle.

Spoon · Feb 14, 2019

Nice vid.
Are you sure he tested it correctly to standards IEC 62606 and 60898-1?
I showed this vid to one of the guys at work. We couldn't find the spec for the Eton on but we looked at a ABB one.
He was testing on a 40W load. That's 0.17A on a 16A device.
The ABB graph doesn't even go down that far. It just goes to 0.1 (which is 1.6A. 10th of 16A) and it is looking for an ark of 1 second at about 2.5A, so could be up to 10 seconds for 0.17A assuming the graph continues up.