Why do commercial sparks bash house bashers?

Electrics · Sep 18, 2021

I've just started an apprenticeship with a decent sized firm (I got taken on full time - hooray!) and was thinking this week about how a lot of people, mostly online, turn their nose up at people who do domestic work.

I was wondering why, since at my work everybody seems to do the bare minimum but with most decent domestic sparks i know, they tend to go the extra mile.

Is there a difference in quality of workmanship simply because people want to do a better job for their own customers as opposed to commercial sparks who are simply getting the job done and aren't personally responsible for the final job?

Just seems to be a lot more 'just get it done' mentality on the commercial side.

Another thing i noticed is hardly anyone has the correct tools for the job and the tools they do have are mashed up.

So people will be using blunt cutters where the tip of one side has shattered off, or drivers with half the shaft insulation hanging off. Then there are other things which not bad but just 'doing it the hard way' like cutting PVC conduit with a hack saw having 3m of it flapping about instead of just buying a £10 pipe cutter, or using hammer and chisel/pad saw to cut out for back boxes where the wall is double skinned chipboard/plasterboard because nobody has a multi tool. Putting up conduit? Simply measure out from some maybe straight maybe wonky reference point and use your 6 inch torpedo level to get it right, instead of simply using a proper spirit level, making the job ten times easier.

When in the domestic setting it seems most people have the basic tools that make life easier.

Is it simply a case of 'not my job, don't care that much' on site compared with running private jobs directly in people's homes?

SparkySy · Sep 20, 2021

I had a similar experience with an older spark when I was coming up through the ranks of a small firm, we were on a library and art Museum, all trunking and conduit very nice job! Anyway it turned out he could not bend tube for love nor money, he even struggled with marking it out correctly, but was great at the trunking work! I ended up doing the conduit work and he did all the trunking in the end!

ipf · Sep 20, 2021

SparkySy said:
I had a similar experience with an older spark when I was coming up through the ranks of a small firm, we were on a library and art Museum, all trunking and conduit very nice job! Anyway it turned out he could not bend tube for love nor money, he even struggled with marking it out correctly, but was great at the trunking work! I ended up doing the conduit work and he did all the trunking in the end!

Somebody else do the wiring? ??

SparkySy · Sep 20, 2021

Yeah a real electrician ?

ipf · Sep 20, 2021

Once left an apprentice to fix a conduit for a sensor in a school boiler house, 2 saddles up a wall and 3 across the ceiling. Got back about 3 hrs later to find it at a 10 degree angle fixed to the ceiling with the outside 2 saddles, the middle one fixed about 1'' to one side of the tube. I CAN laugh NOW!?
He was in the midst of taking it out, I must admit.

Petej999 · Sep 20, 2021

7029 dave said:
I took a job on in a hospital just qualified back in the early 80's, the boss said to me you are taking this job on (yep no problem), all metal conduit work.
Found out the job was given to me because a much older experienced spark (on more money than me) could not do conduit work.
Dont tell me its only labourers work like someone once told me on here.

I took a job with a large builder in my home town Bath, most if not all of the so called Electricians on site were either labourers or Apprentices near the end of their time, it showed up when we had to wire the carpark lighting with SWA NON OF THEN KNEW HOW TO TERMINATE, got a rollicking for taking the time to show them how it was done, this was in the mid 70s got the Spanish Archer for the job going over time left and continued working as a maintenance Spark.

timhoward · Sep 20, 2021

ipf said:
Once left an apprentice to fix a conduit for a sensor in a school boiler house, 2 saddles up a wall and 3 across the ceiling. Got back about 3 hrs later to find it at a 10 degree angle fixed to the ceiling with the outside 2 saddles, the middle one fixed about 1'' to one side of the tube. I CAN laugh NOW!?
He was in the midst of taking it out, I must admit.

It sounds like he almost did the below by accident!

[ElectriciansForums.net] Why do commercial sparks bash house bashers?

Petej999 · Sep 20, 2021

CamoElectric said:
I've just started an apprenticeship with a decent sized firm (I got taken on full time - hooray!) and was thinking this week about how a lot of people, mostly online, turn their nose up at people who do domestic work.

I was wondering why, since at my work everybody seems to do the bare minimum but with most decent domestic sparks i know, they tend to go the extra mile.

Is there a difference in quality of workmanship simply because people want to do a better job for their own customers as opposed to commercial sparks who are simply getting the job done and aren't personally responsible for the final job?

Just seems to be a lot more 'just get it done' mentality on the commercial side.

Another thing i noticed is hardly anyone has the correct tools for the job and the tools they do have are mashed up.

So people will be using blunt cutters where the tip of one side has shattered off, or drivers with half the shaft insulation hanging off. Then there are other things which not bad but just 'doing it the hard way' like cutting PVC conduit with a hack saw having 3m of it flapping about instead of just buying a £10 pipe cutter, or using hammer and chisel/pad saw to cut out for back boxes where the wall is double skinned chipboard/plasterboard because nobody has a multi tool. Putting up conduit? Simply measure out from some maybe straight maybe wonky reference point and use your 6 inch torpedo level to get it right, instead of simply using a proper spirit level, making the job ten times easier.

When in the domestic setting it seems most people have the basic tools that make life easier.

Is it simply a case of 'not my job, don't care that much' on site compared with running private jobs directly in people's homes?

I don't think it's a case of turning up noses Mate, most house bashers are les skilled , not their fault just a case of the pressure of demand, you have slung the wiring in for one new build do the rest of the site with your eyes shut, I did it for a couple of years, not for never again, money was carp as were the conditions, working in those conditions did my whole body no favours whatsoever, basically crippled now, bad back knees etc is it worth it NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Electrics · Sep 20, 2021

timhoward said:
It sounds like he almost did the below by accident!
View attachment 90254

'modern art'

Grant1987 · Sep 22, 2021

timhoward said:
It sounds like he almost did the below by accident!
View attachment 90254

If I seen that I would call 999. My comments were derogatory to the metal munching industry which I do still enjoy just took offence to the house bashers which I’m a member of these days. We are a divisive industry but like I said previously all have the same goal I’ll upload photos tomorrow of my shed all galv conduit and trunking work of art it is. All trainees on here do it all and enjoy the job like I do, infact we all do that’s why we offer our opinions/advice on here ?

Grant1987 · Sep 22, 2021

Petej999 said:
I don't think it's a case of turning up noses Mate, most house bashers are les skilled , not their fault just a case of the pressure of demand, you have slung the wiring in for one new build do the rest of the site with your eyes shut, I did it for a couple of years, not for never again, money was carp as were the conditions, working in those conditions did my whole body no favours whatsoever, basically crippled now, bad back knees etc is it worth it NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

House bashers less skilled shame on you!!!

Grant1987 · Sep 22, 2021

Grant1987 said:
House bashers less skilled shame on you!!!

Money crap? Earn more now than I ever have. Built the trust and custom of domestic properties and havnt looked back since #housebasher

Electrics · Sep 22, 2021

Grant1987 said:
Money crap? Earn more now than I ever have. Built the trust and custom of domestic properties and havnt looked back since #housebasher

Yeah i mean on most commercial jobs you're gonna be agency, subbying or working cards in for a contractor. Pay is lousy on most run of the mill jobs. Our lads start on £15.80 an hour rising to £16.50 an hour. £34k a year before tax and overheads. That's crap.

Mikegh · Sep 23, 2021

They do and it's not justified considering how technical the domestic work has got

I've seen the industrial electricians struggle with rcds a few times

Intoelectrics · Sep 23, 2021

Mikegh said:
They do and it's not justified considering how technical the domestic work has got

I've seen the industrial electricians struggle with rcds a few times

I agree, I don't think we should tar everyone with the same brush. We should applaud and support our industry and the people within it in all aspects of the job! A skilled electrician is a skilled tradesperson regardless of whether its domestic, commercial, industrial or any other...

The crux of the matter is in the training and experience, in my opinion, these days there is not enough of either implemented before a person earns the title of "Electrician".

Unfortunately "house bashing" is one area where a less experienced and poorly learned person can get away with shoddy work or corner cutting because most is hidden and the work is mostly self regulated. So it's natural that a dodgy tradesperson will aim for work where they can earn decent money, be less likely to exposure without the worry of retribution. These people create a stigma around domestic work which tars the proper electricians with the same brush. Its unfair and unjustified, so the last thing we want is slander within our own group.

Grant1987 · Sep 24, 2021

MoserV8 said:
I would have to disagree there? Every Commercial & Industrial Job requires testing and Certificates handing in, in-fact the testing is more involved in an industrial/commercial environment, I frequently do work in schools and no stone goes unturned & certificates are allways handed in. Test & Inspecting factories can be a complex & lengthy procedure. Im not knocking Domestic Electricians at all, Ive seen some tremendously skilled ones who have completed rewires in occupied houses and got cables only where i could dream! With minimal disturbances to residents LOLS.

I’m reading this post back again and I can assure you that testing on the commercial/industrial side is not any more different as the domestic I won’t go into too much detail but sampling is a common theme with so many DB’s In com/ind industry so it’s a rotational testing theme. As for leaving no stone unturned do me a favour! ?‍

It’s a Lengthy and complex procedure it’s the same process with single phase in domestic